Carbide Chains

[Crzybowhntr]

jayme i have a stihl 325 carbide chain i can bring if we ever get a chance to cut together i like its durability and why i have 2 now

Next time. I forgot all about it last time.

 

[brushwacker]

Carbide Coated Chains

(description from an eBay seller)

“A customized “carbitron” process electronically impregnates titanium tungsten carbide into the surface of each cutting tooth, leaving a very hard coating that “will not” chip, flake, crack or become brittle. The .002 thick carbide coating can be sharpened the same as any standard chain saw chain.

Unlike the standard carbide tipped chain, the carbide coated chain uses a less expensive process of only replacing the chromium normally found layered on top of each cutter with carbide. Since it’s the top layer of carbide that actually does the cutting, this chain should “last 5 to 10 times longer” than the standard saw chain because you don’t have to sharpen it as often. The “carbitron” chain

Should not be confused with or replace true carbide tipped chain because it is not designed to go through the kind of obstructions firemen & others endure.”


Philbert

I had 25' of this type chain, brand labed Laser in .325 .o63 full chisel. Was aggressive and stayed sharp longer then conventional full chisel, I would say a small to modest step above RM semi chisel Stihl for staying sharp. No problems filing it and no cutters I remember breaking or chipping prematurely. I liked the chain but 5 to 10 times longer staying sharp I'd say isn't what I got. May be 2 times longer then conventional chisel if that. List price is awful high for it IMO.
I used a 16" .o50 picco loop of PD3 on my 025. By the time it needed sharpened about 20% of the cutters were broke off or chipped. About the hardest foreign matter it might of hit to my knowledge is may have been a piece of ice in the crotch of a tree. Mostly normal wood I cut, did have some with a film of silt from high water that it worked well on. I don't think the chassis last any different then conventional and with the cutters chipping and breaking the chain wasn't worth sharpening, so it actually had a shorter then normal life, but without a need to sharpen it. I have 2 new ones on stand by. If I have a good paying job and need them to get it done in a reasonable amount of time, I will use them. Not worth the price for firewood cutting.
I would like to try the Stihl in .325, .063 thinking the cutters are beefier and more cutters per bar inch, may be they will hold up better.

 

[Wilhelm]

Dolmar PS-6400, Stihl Rapid Duro 3 (3/8"; .058"; 72DL; 20"), oak round - noodling performance:

 

[Wilhelm]

So, I got first damage on my RD3 3/8" loop.

Using my carbide chain to noodle someone else's knotty bone dry beech rounds that were tossed forth and back in the woodshed wasn't the brightest idea - I realize that now.
Luckily the damage is less than I initially feared after having seen sparks fly.
One cutter is chipped strongly (must have taken full impact with the foreign object), two cutter show chipping on the side plate and two or three cutters are visibly dull but without real damage.
All damaged and dull cutters are left handed ones, I definitely hit something disagreeing with the carbide tips.

I will touch up the dull carbide inserts once I finally buy a diamond file.

This one took full impact:


Two cutters look like this:


Opinions regarding the Stihl Rapid Duro 3:
- it is by far the most smooth cutting chain I ever had the pleasure to cut with, this applies for both bucking and noodling.
- it is excellent for noodling knots because of the smaller bite it takes, almost no chatter to speak of.
- it cuts slower than a round ground/filed regular steel chisel chain but makes up for it in smoothness.
- behavior upon impact with foreign objects (anything hard that is not wood) is not so good as the carbide inserts break and chip. This could be an indiction that the carbide inserts used are a bit too hard (I see this on drills, solid carbide drills from one manufacturer chip and break, while drills from another manufacturer only "dent" and eventually burn up due to being dull - material being processed is grey cast iron, processing rpm's and feed's high).

I'll keep the RD3 as the main setup on my Dolmar PS-6400 unless I got some crappy job at hand.

Once I get my next load of firewood logs I'll surely continue using the RD3, it is a nice chain for processing firewood logs.

 

[Philbert]

Order a few extra feet of chain for replacement links / cutters?

Philbert

 

[Wilhelm]

I guess that would be the best way for keeping the loop usable over a prolonged period of time, and yes a couple feet should keep for a while.
One issue though, I don't have a breaker nor spinner!

I'll see how this loop will continue to hold up.

I really like it, I hope to wear it down much more before the carbide inserts give up completely.

 

[Philbert]

I don't have a breaker nor spinner!

Here is your justification for acquiring one!

Aside from their utility, I found having a spinner and breaker set very 'empowering'. They let me resize, repair, and repurpose chains. Using them also helped me to better understand the components: how they vary, how they wear, etc.

With all of the tinkering that you do with chains, I am confident that you will really appreciate having a set. And the cost is probably no more than you pay for one carbide chain!

Philbert

 

[Wilhelm]

Here is your justification for acquiring one!

Aside from their utility, I found having a spinner and breaker set very 'empowering'. They let me resize, repair, and repurpose chains. Using them also helped me to better understand the components: how they vary, how they wear, etc.

With all of the tinkering that you do with chains, I am confident that you will really appreciate having a set. And the cost is probably no more than you pay for one carbide chain!

Philbert

Interesting point of view.
But I don't tinker with chains - I just play with them!

I don't need a breaker & spinner . . . , I don't need a breaker & spinner . . . , I don't need a breaker & spinner . . . , I don't need a breaker & spinner . . . , I don't need a breaker & spinner . . . , I don't need a breaker & spinner . . . , I don't need a breaker & spinner . . . , I don't need a breaker & spinner . . . , I don't need a breaker & spinner . . .

 

[Wilhelm]

Then again . . . , I didn't need a carbide chain either - lest two of them!

 

[redoakneck]

I've been telling myself I don't NEED a spinner / breaker set, but man they would be handy.

My OCD would have me collecting all kinds of sizes needed to repair any chain, that's where I see it getting spensive

 

[Homemade]

Great Info guys. I've been considering carbide for our wood and brush saws on our fire dept. we have one vent saw with carbide and we waited way too long to get the carbides replaced. Half of the cutters were chipped or missing. I'm going with a chain from sure-vent. They make the saw kit we have. I've heard mix reviews on the billet and thinking about the Stihl rapid duro for the other saws.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Philbert]

Then again . . . , I didn't need a carbide chain either - lest two of them!

I've been telling myself I don't NEED a spinner / breaker set . . .

My OCD would have me collecting all kinds of sizes . . .

Collecting chains is a whole lot cheaper than collecting saws!

Now, back to carbide chains . . .

Philbert

 

[Wilhelm]

Great Info guys. I've been considering carbide for our wood and brush saws on our fire dept. we have one vent saw with carbide and we waited way too long to get the carbides replaced. Half of the cutters were chipped or missing. I'm going with a chain from sure-vent. They make the saw kit we have. I've heard mix reviews on the billet and thinking about the Stihl rapid duro for the other saws.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I wouldn't recommend the Stihl Rapid Duro3 for roof venting!
As far as I understand the RD3 is intended for cutting wood, dirt infested is fine but nails I doubt it will handle well.

The Stihl Rapid Duro3 has nice large carbide inserts that are shaped and sharpened like a regular round ground semi chisel tooth.
The gullet is more restricted on the RD3 due to the steel base on which the carbide insert resides.

That been said I imagine the RD3 to be a good chain for clearing storm blown trees.

There is also another Stihl Rapid Duro with a smaller carbide insert and a different cutter geometry - maybe that one is tougher than the RD3?!

 

[Drptrch]

I wouldn't recommend the Stihl Rapid Duro3 for roof venting!
As far as I understand the RD3 is intended for cutting wood, dirt infested is fine but nails I doubt it will handle well.

The Stihl Rapid Duro3 has nice large carbide inserts that are shaped and sharpened like a regular round ground semi chisel tooth.
The gullet is more restricted on the RD3 due to the steel base on which the carbide insert resides.

That been said I imagine the RD3 to be a good chain for clearing storm blown trees.

There is also another Stihl Rapid Duro with a smaller carbide insert and a different cutter geometry - maybe that one is tougher than the RD3?!

Rapco Terminator

http://www.baileysonline.com/Chains...ain-404-x-063/Rapco-Terminator-Carbide-Chain/

 

[Homemade]

I wouldn't recommend the Stihl Rapid Duro3 for roof venting!

There is also another Stihl Rapid Duro with a smaller carbide insert and a different cutter geometry - maybe that one is tougher than the RD3?!

(I can't multi-quote in Tapatalk)
I never said anything about the RD3. Talked about the rapid duro, but not rd3....

Rapid Duro 3

Rapid duro

Stihl Rescue
This is the one I am thinking about but need a new guide bar, the only offer in .063 and we run .050.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Wilhelm]

(I can't multi-quote in Tapatalk)
I never said anything about the RD3. Talked about the rapid duro, but not rd3....

Rapid Duro 3

Rapid duro

Stihl Rescue
This is the one I am thinking about but need a new guide bar, the only offer in .063 and we run .050.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I realized that and didn't want to imply that You intended to use a RD3 - just wanted to be helpful and point out that the RD3 is not suited for extreme conditions!
It is possible that it came out the wrong way - sorry , English is my third language.

I can not comment nor argue about any other carbide chains as RD3 is the only I have.

 

[Khntr85]

@Philbert hey I have a few questions on these chains if you don't mind....I sadly, will be hand digging my septic line soon....I know I will have to cut some good sized tree roots....I also have afew jobs were one of these chains could come in handy......I have been contemplating getting one of these chains, but as you know they are high priced...

You know a little about me, you know I like working with chains in general, and I hate to see one go to waste....I love when guys throw out safety chain, I take all I can get....I have a "salvaged" semi-shisel chain for just about every bar size I have.....I like to keep these salvaged chains for stumping, real dirty wood, or when I know there is foreign object somewere in the wood!!!

I guess my question is, what is the biggest benefit if the carbide chain over my salvaged RM chain...is the biggest benefit of this chain the fact that it stays sharp longer....another thing that kinda puts me off about this chain is the fact that the cutters chip/broke so easy....

Also donthey sell a regular type chain file for these...

 

[Philbert]

I have never personally used a carbide chain; I don't think that I have the right applications for them. Clearly, firefighters who have to quickly cut building materials; cutting special stuff, like old railroad ties; unusually abrasive, exotic woods come to mind. Look through the thread and be sure to pick the style and type best suited for your application (e.g. 'bullet chains' don't do as well in trees as they do on roofs).

For occasional tree roots, I think that these are the best solution: about $2-3 each. Disposable. Lots of brands: 'reciprocating saw pruning blades'



Philbert

 

[Wilhelm]

You can file carbide chains, but You need a diamond file.
Also a carbide chain will not be using a file diameter identical to a regular chain, it seems to require a smaller diameter file.

 

[Drptrch]

Don't use a carbide chain designed for Fire Dept "Vent Work" cutters are too closely spaced and don't die well on green wood
Baileys has a line "Rapco" that makes a specific vent chain ( Terminator) but others for dirty tree work, biggest problem is grit in the rails and sprockets.
Use a hard nose bar.

If you dig out around root, I second the recip blade, they work great as long as tip doesn't bottom out on something hard