Tree Felling Technique Thread

[Willard]

Good stuff gents.

Question: how much lean can be overcome with wedges as a general rule of thumb. I was eyeballing an ash yesterday, about 17” dbh, 10 to 15* of back lean, 75 feet tall.

To calculate lift off the stump to overcome back lean you need to estimate tree height, diameter of trunk from apex of facecut to back of trunk.
Tree height ÷ diameter = segments.
100ft÷ 1ft = 100 segments
OR
1200 inch tree (100ft) that is 20 inches diameter 1200÷20=60 segments.
One segment equals 1 inch movement at top of tree.

 

[jakethesnake]

Shallower face cut will let you lift tree easier. Westboastfaller helped on that subject over yonder. Pivot point

 

[Coltont]

Shallower face cut will let you lift tree easier. Westboastfaller helped on that subject over yonder. Pivot point

Shallow face cut will be you in the ass too. Better know what your doing and when to use it. 1/3 the diameter of the tree for the depth of your notch minimum. Then pitch of the angle for your face cut etc.. ..... . It's the science of getting good at guessing, then getting a little better than that.

 

[jacob j.]

Shallow face cut will be you in the ass too. Better know what your doing and when to use it. 1/3 the diameter of the tree for the depth of your notch minimum. Then pitch of the angle for your face cut etc.. ..... . It's the science of getting good at guessing, then getting a little better than that.

Spot on...for snags I was always taught 1/3 to 1/2 the diameter for the face, depending on if/how much the snag leaned and if you were planning on taking it away from its' lean/inclination.

I've had Doug Fir snags that were over 50" DBH and I took near 1/2 the diameter for the face because I was falling them 90 degrees to the lean.

 

[Coltont]

Spot on...for snags I was always taught 1/3 to 1/2 the diameter for the face, depending on if/how much the snag leaned and if you were planning on taking it away from its' lean/inclination.

I've had Doug Fir snags that were over 50" DBH and I took near 1/2 the diameter for the face because I was falling them 90 degrees to the lean.

Leverage gravity wind wedges Jack's. You can make trees listen if you can keep from being impatient.

 

[Skeans1]

Leverage gravity wind wedges Jack's. You can make trees listen if you can keep from being impatient.

And sometimes it’s the order in which stuff goes in. No scratch faces for you?


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[Coltont]

And sometimes it’s the order in which stuff goes in. No scratch faces for you?


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No scratch faces. If it's 6 inches or under maybe. You have it rite mentioning order.

 

[Willard]

Wind can be your friend but don't get in the position to curse at it

Guesstimating back lean does take experience for your size of timber.
For mine I carry three 10" wedges, if 1 won't tip the tree the other 2 will get it done. If not then I'm going back to the truck for 2 more, Lol.
Pretty tough to drive 3 stacked wedges without spitting out but just that wee bit of extra lift it can work.
Rough or barb side of wedge against stump with single wedge. Double wedges smooth side against each other.

 

[XP_Slinger]

Good info guys. Thank you.

 

[Willard]

To calculate lift off the stump to overcome back lean you need to estimate tree height, diameter of trunk from apex of facecut to back of trunk.
Tree height ÷ diameter = segments.
100ft÷ 1ft = 100 segments
OR
1200 inch tree (100ft) that is 20 inches diameter 1200÷20=60 segments.
One segment equals 1 inch movement at top of tree.

XPslinger, so to better explain that if your tree is 75 feet tall and if 17 inches diameter then after you make you facecut it's 12 inch diameter from the apex(inside corner)of the facecut notch to the back of the tree.
75ft ÷ 1 ft (12") =75 segments
So a 1"inch thick wedge lift at the stump driven in flush would move the top 75" inches. More then enough or maybe 2 for your backlean. I just couldn't figure out your backlean you quoted in degrees.
So to add in my original post "one segment equals 1 inch movement at top of tree WITH A 1" THICK WEDGE."

 

[XP_Slinger]

XPslinger, so to better explain that if your tree is 75 feet tall and if 17 inches diameter then after you make you facecut it's 12 inch diameter from the apex(inside corner)of the facecut notch to the back of the tree.
75ft ÷ 1 ft (12") =75 segments
So a 1"inch thick wedge lift at the stump driven in flush would move the top 75" inches. More then enough or maybe 2 for your backlean. I just couldn't figure out your backlean you quoted in degrees.
So to add in my original post "one segment equals 1 inch movement at top of tree WITH A 1" THICK WEDGE."

Thanks for the further explanation, makes more sense now. Went clear over my head initially lol

 

[Willard]

XP_Slinger, you said your tree was 75 ft tall with 10° - 15° backlean.
I normally judge backlean as a plumb line from top of tree to ground where I see how many feet to trunk at ground level.
So I figure if you have 10 to 15° lean on a 75 ft tree that's about 9 to 12 feet backlean.
12 feet or 144" can then be tipped with two 1 " thick wedges that will move 150" at the top of your 75 ft tree.

 

[XP_Slinger]

XP_Slinger, you said your tree was 75 ft tall with 10° - 15° backlean.
I normally judge backlean as a plumb line from top of tree to ground where I see how many feet to trunk at ground level.
So I figure if you have 10 to 15° lean on a 75 ft tree that's about 9 to 12 feet backlean.
12 feet or 144" can then be tipped with two 1 " thick wedges that will move 150" at the top of your 75 ft tree.

That’s a great tip to visualize a plumb Line to the ground. I’m going to reassess this tree using the formula you’ve given and report back.

 

[Willard]

Get even more complicated with broad harwood trees . I quoted above for a single stem conifer.

I was taught in hardwood trees I need to estimate lean by averaging half of the trees upper bio mass. As these trees branch out with many stems and limbs .
So like my 7 ft tall stickman pic shows this is how its done.

 

[RI Chevy]

Lol. You using crayons? Lol

 

[Skeans1]

That’s a great tip to visualize a plumb Line to the ground. I’m going to reassess this tree using the formula you’ve given and report back.

How confident are you at making a square level back cut first? Sometimes it’s easier to start wedging before you start a face basically backwards of everything you’ve ever been taught unless you started out jacking when getting broke in.


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[junkman]

How confident are you at making a square level back cut first? Sometimes it’s easier to start wedging before you start a face basically backwards of everything you’ve ever been taught unless you started out jacking when getting broke in.


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That's how i fall 180 against the lean or into the wind.do the back cut first set 3 wedges then face it , works good for fir ,cedar is more tricky because its so soft the wedges smash the wood.

 

[huskihl]

I go up a ladder with a strap and pull leaners wif da chebby. Hammers are heavy

 

[XP_Slinger]

Get even more complicated with broad harwood trees . I quoted above for a single stem conifer.

I was taught in hardwood trees I need to estimate lean by averaging half of the trees upper bio mass. As these trees branch out with many stems and limbs .
So like my 7 ft tall stickman pic shows this is how its done.
View attachment 168844

Call me a dork but I saved your picture for reference...lol!

 

[XP_Slinger]

How confident are you at making a square level back cut first? Sometimes it’s easier to start wedging before you start a face basically backwards of everything you’ve ever been taught unless you started out jacking when getting broke in.


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Confident. Never thought of doing that. The last tree I sent 180 against its lean I bored the center of the face and opened up the back for a wedge. Then Bored behind the hinge and opened it up for a wedge on each side. Released the remaining hold wood between the wedges and tipped it over with the wedges. Probably more work than back cutting first but it worked well.