Three Husqvarna 562xp builds, How do they stack up?

[afleetcommand]

I've also found out as I'm sure most of you have that the type of chain on the saw i.e. Sharpness, angle of grind, size of cutters,depth gauges etc. can make all the difference in the world for me. I'm constantly amazed at the wood pile when I'm runny a stock or ported saw & cutting some wood with dirt on it what a difference a new filed chain makes! I get lulled into gradually pushing harder on the saw, taking longer on each cut,then when I switch or sharpen the chain it is like a completely different saw! I probably wait to long on chain touch up but the advances in speed & effciency make me feel almost like I've got a modified saw when many times I don't! I know this doesn't really have a lot to do with the modified vs non modified saw discussion but I just was thinking about it after reading this discussion. BTW Walt I really like what you did with that 560!

Hoping if we go with another GTG with enthusiasts someone picks up on that concept and starts the "setup" concept as a topic equally important to real performance as motor mods. Bob points that out all the time and we tease about it when ever the opportunity presents to put the subject front and center. Really would like someone who has gone the extra mile to carry the conversation as well.

 

[Sty57]

Been thinking of the 550xp as a possible old man saw for myself. Have yet to try one though, how does it compare relative to the 562xp, if that is even fair to say.

Yes you have Steve, you ran my 2253 at Scotts GTG. Next time I come up your way, I'll bring it along and you can play with it some more.

 

[Mastermind]

I've long said that the best mod on a 550 or 562 is just a popup piston and a muffler mod that leaves the baffles intact.

 

[Stump Shot]

Yes you have Steve, you ran my 2253 at Scotts GTG. Next time I come up your way, I'll bring it along and you can play with it some more.

Ok then, if that is the case, I like it.

 

[afleetcommand]

Thanks for the video, I guess I can summarize the following for those not going to watch the whole thing:

Saw 1 - stock 562xp with stock bar
Saw 2 - “essentially” a 560xp. Popup piston, gasket delete and muffler mod, using Oregon’s new laminated speedcut bar.
Saw 3 - 562xp with popup piston, muffler mod, gasket delete, using a Tsumura lightweight bar.

Saw 2 & 3 are faster than saw 1. Estimated cut times are around 2 seconds faster.

Using a bathroom scale Saws 2 & 3 are lighter than saw 1, by about 2 lbs.

A 372xp and a 390xp weigh the same amount, roughly 2 lbs more than a 562xp.

An old saw your father would have used was 10lbs heavier than a 390xp and slower than a 562xp.

Yup thats pretty much it with a few tweaks:

The Saw 3 is a gasket delete with a trimmed cylinder skirt at the bottom (.040) and at the lower transfers..1184 base gasket even though the cylinder is decked a bit. Popup. Slight intake timing "adjustment". el48 with latest firmware. Cut cover. Plugged decomp. approx. .018 squish.

Saw 2 is similar with the exception it has slightly different intake numbers and actually has a "stock" base gasket. Less popup but still a popup with approx. .022 squish. Saw two is a collection of junk created while figuring out saw three.. Saw "3" is a bit more powerful than saw 2 actually and was build to what I learned over a period of time, but that's hopefully because of moving it in the right direction....a few more need to give me feed back from the field before I truly know thought right? Two years and still going though! (Around 6 of them in a test rotation BTW, two with 1184. Rest base gaskets....and when they come through I re-cut the cylinders to base gasket cuts as I tear them down as part of my little R&D project. ( Although...none of the 1184's have failed BTW makes me question that logic from time to time )

Both mufflers have been modded in a similar way.

Covered a few other concepts too....as this thread is beginning to flush out.

 

[Stump Shot]

@afleetcommand
Have to say though Walt, I really like what you did here with your ultimate old man saw, in that you took a bunch of existing pieces and assembled them in a fashion to your liking. Very DIY kind of thing anyone with that same mindset can do themselves. Wether or not this pans out to be what you wanted or not it's still a win for the community as a whole. Who knows, someone else's build might be your ultimate saw. It's what is so great about this place, people sharing their experiences, even if most aren't your cup of tea, sooner or later one will come along that makes you go yeah...why didn't I think of that, and away you go.
Lots of subjects touched on this thread. A lot relative to my little part of the world as I know it.
Perspectives: Lots of 'em here, sometimes it can get confusing when a repairman a restoration and a modification guy are talking about the same saw but all three having different experiences for example. Some times this works out some times not so much. Sometimes all three can have a different answer and all of them be the correct one. It can take a bit to sort out and apply to the direction you are heading.
Stock vs Modded: I still have and run stock saws that I will never mod, they do their job well and if proper upkeep is done on them they will continue to do so.(My 266xp for example) To me saws that need modded are the ones not quite cutting the mustard so to speak. Bumping up a not Pro saw and making it have Pro saw attributes is a worthwhile endeavor. Also the aged saw, one that time has passed on, catching up can be a cost effective way to stay current with the times. There's room for both in my world and I even like some old timers in there to keep a good perspective on just how good we have it.
Chains: Everything I thought I knew about chains was pretty much dead wrong or so it would seem. This is a huge subject that I would agree needs more attention than is given to it.
Fun factor: I can say without a doubt that my saws aren't for everyone, I don't care about P-revs and how fast a saw is on cutting up lumber, rather how well it hold up in the cut with a large bar relative to it's size. My saws are fun to me, as well is messing with them, this should be everyone's ultimate objective, as we are after all unique individuals with different ideas about what is good. I'm also still learning something every day and I hope to continue for a long, long time.
Direction: While all this knowledge available at our fingertips is great and all, at some point you just have to get out to the shop and try a thing or two for yourself. It's OK to fail once in a while even, at least you know what not to do. Experience is a great teacher along with the spark of an idea is where the next great thing will come from, I hope everyone can get out and see what they can accomplish.
Appreciation: I keep a hand saw and a double bit axe here, once in a while I like to give them a go, it puts what we're doing today into the being spoiled category real fast.



I think there's room here for all our hopes and dreams of what a great saw should be, and the people that use them.

 

[Stump Shot]

Been thinking of the 550xp as a possible old man saw for myself. Have yet to try one though, how does it compare relative to the 562xp, if that is even fair to say.

After some reflection I think I would like to amend this to a 550xpg as my possible ultimate old man saw. Might as well have warm hands, my circulation won't be getting any better, nor will the arthritis...

 

[afleetcommand]

Sounds like we think along the same lines. Thanks for the clarification

 

[Tor R]

After some reflection I think I would like to amend this to a 550xpg as my possible ultimate old man saw. Might as well have warm hands, my circulation won't be getting any better, nor will the arthritis...

550xpg + old man is a good combo.
550's heathers is the one I gotta shut down now and then unlike the 346 heather, they produce quite alot heat lol

 

[Farmchuck]

My

After some reflection I think I would like to amend this to a 550xpg as my possible ultimate old man saw. Might as well have warm hands, my circulation won't be getting any better, nor will the arthritis...

next saw will have heated handles.

 

[Spike60]

What I like about this discussion is that guys are pointing out the different aspects of the hobby that appeal to them without finding fault with other's preferences. To people who aren't into the saw thing, saws are saws. But when you think about it there are some distinct tangents that you can focus your energy on. Old, new, stock, modded, 100cc muscle saws, 50cc screamers. 70cc work saws. Ugly saws for firewood and collector grade saws that you hate to get dirty. It's a more diversified hobby than would be apparent to those on the outside.

Modding saws is just one of them, and even when doing that, there are variations as to how sophisticated you get and how much time you can allocate to building a saw. I passed on a free lathe a couple years ago, cause I was having fun with the basic mods we were doing and didn't want to go the next step which I figured could double or triple the time involved. But it was also a matter of being happy where I was and not wanting to change it.

I think I get the most fun from the dead saw salvage "junk pile" projects that Walt and I started out with 6-7 years ago and continue to do. Stock at first, but then we began working in some mods. Saws like that Jonny "636" I mentioned earlier. It's not just how much power you can get out of a saw; sometimes it's as simple as how much work you can get out of a saw. Especially one that's been left for dead.

And I'm also into some of the old stuff that doesn't get much mention on this site, but I suspect there are more guys who share this interest. After my Huskys and Jonnys, I'm into the McCulloch and Homelite American classics. Have about a dozen of each. I've always read a lot of history so saw history is a natural fit for me. As you move back on the timeline to the Jonsered 70E's and Husky L77's, you are going back to an era where the Macs and Homies still outsold Husky and Stihl by a wide margin. At least once a year I like to drag out some of these saws and have a vintage cutting day. Fun to run something different and these saws have a few unique exhaust notes that sound great echoing through the woods. Walt and I are planning a day where we take some of them into the woods and get some of these classic saws on video. Better in my mind to enjoy some old saw experiences than to just tell old saw stories.

 

[XP_Slinger]

I get more satisfaction out of bringing an abused dead saw back to life than I do modding them. Probably why I love my 288 so much. There are certainly more layers of this "chainsaw thing" than meets the eye.

 

[XP_Slinger]

I'm really interested and looking forward to what you two concoct when that machine tool arrives......THAT will be fun for me to see over time. Those tools just allow you to put the ideas into form. Individual creativity enhanced. Jason Walker is another one I'm damn near motivated to donate a machine tool to see what he creates. Maybe you need to develop an informal CNY bring what you build type yearly event? I have a spot and resources. That was the cool part of Randy's FT660 GTG concept for me. The bring what you built part... AND the tangible results of how the FT Kits effected the hobby and community long term. Maybe a twist on that theme? Two classes....machined with the contestants machine and tweaked with a contestants file the second class. Thats it. has to be based on a Stock OEM saw with simply a purchase price limit...say $700 bucks. Have start from cold as part of the deal. That would allow those with developing skills to scratch the itch. Would ENCOURAGE the growth of basic skills as well. Would be fun to stand back and host something like that. I also would be interested in having folks bring "woods craft" skills into the mix some how. That could be a milling to widget type thing. Turning cookies to something other than firewood? Poplar to benches? Don't have a definite concept. But after retirement will be looking to develop something along those lines. Have a "AHRMA" race every year here...Cross Country & Motocross. Might be fun to bring some thing saw related to life. Also the historical. I personally still like bringing the old antiques to life. Just as rewarding as a work saw build on a 576 to me.

Just re-reading some of your ideas for this potential gathering and I think bringing woodcraft into the mix would be a great addition. Here's what I've been making recently, VERY satisfying and relaxing to shave out a handle. I would enjoy seeing what others are making out of their slabs. Hope this isn't too much of a derail, I'm really enjoying this thread.

 

[afleetcommand]

View attachment 99873
Just re-reading some of your ideas for this potential gathering and I think bringing woodcraft into the mix would be a great addition. Here's what I've been making recently, VERY satisfying and relaxing to shave out a handle. I would enjoy seeing what others are making out of their slabs. Hope this isn't too much of a derail, I'm really enjoying this thread.

Those are REALLY cool! I've been saw focused more than I like at times. Really want to get back in the woods while I still can. My wife & I realized those hedgerows provide a source of really cool wood, ash, cherry, maple, oak etc. Stuff that would never make dimensional lumber, but would make really cool tables, benches, chairs etc. Never had the time to explore that creative side of this hobby. Hoping to this summer. Lots to learn for me. How to process the wood, finish, etc. Along with finding a band saw and planer concept thats big enough. STILL have to do another cut for triaxle loads to sell and firewood. But want to "branch(?)" out in other woodcraft directions as well. Of course if my saw world was centered around racing..things would be different.

ON the "Saw Mod" front I think I kind of went end to end with my saws and realized there is a balance for me of time investment vs. results. Especially with the advent of the Autotunes where the cylinders are "right" from the factory. Then as time has gone on realized the best saw mods are ones tailored to my priorities, bar, sprocket, and chains being huge... the things that effect my day in the woods. So have begun to focus on those for the available "mod" time in my life. UOMS is the first where I did a clean sheet and just asked myself (VERY selfish and self center..I know) whats important to me and built a saw to focus on those things. Going to tweak a few variants on that theme for the general saw. Then do a small saw and a large saw concept. Thats the direction for me to squeeze in between "life" over time. I guess what happened is I realize I have to balance shop time with woods time. Not obsess in the shop on the minutia trying for some hypothetical edge....on what? When really the definition of win is how it works when I'm out working, not an extra .25 seconds in a test log or 300 RPM on top. If they are reliable, easy to start and manipulate, the woods experience is more rewarding.

 

[Simondo]

What I like about this discussion is that guys are pointing out the different aspects of the hobby that appeal to them without finding fault with other's preferences. To people who aren't into the saw thing, saws are saws. But when you think about it there are some distinct tangents that you can focus your energy on. Old, new, stock, modded, 100cc muscle saws, 50cc screamers. 70cc work saws. Ugly saws for firewood and collector grade saws that you hate to get dirty. It's a more diversified hobby than would be apparent to those on the outside.

Modding saws is just one of them, and even when doing that, there are variations as to how sophisticated you get and how much time you can allocate to building a saw. I passed on a free lathe a couple years ago, cause I was having fun with the basic mods we were doing and didn't want to go the next step which I figured could double or triple the time involved. But it was also a matter of being happy where I was and not wanting to change it.

I think I get the most fun from the dead saw salvage "junk pile" projects that Walt and I started out with 6-7 years ago and continue to do. Stock at first, but then we began working in some mods. Saws like that Jonny "636" I mentioned earlier. It's not just how much power you can get out of a saw; sometimes it's as simple as how much work you can get out of a saw. Especially one that's been left for dead.

And I'm also into some of the old stuff that doesn't get much mention on this site, but I suspect there are more guys who share this interest. After my Huskys and Jonnys, I'm into the McCulloch and Homelite American classics. Have about a dozen of each. I've always read a lot of history so saw history is a natural fit for me. As you move back on the timeline to the Jonsered 70E's and Husky L77's, you are going back to an era where the Macs and Homies still outsold Husky and Stihl by a wide margin. At least once a year I like to drag out some of these saws and have a vintage cutting day. Fun to run something different and these saws have a few unique exhaust notes that sound great echoing through the woods. Walt and I are planning a day where we take some of them into the woods and get some of these classic saws on video. Better in my mind to enjoy some old saw experiences than to just tell old saw stories.

Good points Bob....
Myself ..I like the little saws . Some of that is down to cutting my teeth on softwood thinning with the 242 xp back in the day.
Aprox 80% of the saws that come through the door in my shop would be 50 cc or bellow ..they are the "Go To" saw of the tree service and the firewood cutter alike over here .
A few Husq and Dolmar saws in that class that i have iv played about with , but more and more these days i just pick up a modern 40cc class saw with just a cat removal for 90% of my firewood and hedge line work.
Its not often i feel the need for more cc and weight "when taking apart the top of the average size tree" (lots of top in the timber i cut) i need to tackle . You would have thought I would be the perfect candidate for port work to turn that 40cc into the power of a 50cc saw wouldn't you ! ...If I pick the right ones....even stock little saws make for a productive and enjoyable time ...IMO of corse .

 

[afleetcommand]

Good points Bob....
Myself ..I like the little saws . Some of that is down to cutting my teeth on softwood thinning with the 242 xp back in the day.
Aprox 80% of the saws that come through the door in my shop would be 50 cc or bellow ..they are the "Go To" saw of the tree service and the firewood cutter alike over here .
A few Husq and Dolmar saws in that class that i have iv played about with , but more and more these days i just pick up a modern 40cc class saw with just a cat removal for 90% of my firewood and hedge line work.
Its not often i feel the need for more cc and weight "when taking apart the top of the average size tree" (lots of top in the timber i cut) i need to tackle . You would have thought I would be the perfect candidate for port work to turn that 40cc into the power of a 50cc saw wouldn't you ! ...If I pick the right ones....even stock little saws make for a productive and enjoyable time ...IMO of corse .

Maybe a hot rod and lightened 550?? Some one already mentioned that as a direction. Also looking to find a small saw option.....a brush laser. Love those 242's! What are options in your world that would make a good small saw platform?? We have echo's around here, and now a cheap source of efco's. Just I know little to nothing about them. I don't like working on the small Stihl's in the 170/180 line though. What would you suggest??

 

[Simondo]

Maybe a hot rod and lightened 550?? Some one already mentioned that as a direction. Also looking to find a small saw option.....a brush laser. Love those 242's! What are options in your world that would make a good small saw platform?? We have echo's around here, and now a cheap source of efco's. Just I know little to nothing about them. I don't like working on the small Stihl's in the 170/180 line though. What would you suggest??

That is a very tricky thing to do Walt but il take a stab at it.
Yea...I wouldn't chose Stihl 170/180 ether ..BUT !.. they will have there supporters .
If the budget is good and Bod can hook you up with a 550 then your working knowledge on those 562/560 's is a real advantage .
Efco..no real knowledge on them .
You want new, small, modern spring AV and cheeper (not 242 xp shape ).... il chuck in a curve ball for you, Dolmar ps-35 ....
you want more saw then Ps-421 . How much you want to play around with the saws might be a deciding factor but the Dolmar saws hit high comp from factory so are peppy stock ...ps 35 on left..ps 421 (we have the 420..same saw) right . All ..IMO ..of corse .

 

[afleetcommand]

That is a very tricky thing to do Walt but il take a stab at it.
Yea...I wouldn't chose Stihl 170/180 ether ..BUT !.. they will have there supporters .
If the budget is good and Bod can hook you up with a 550 then your working knowledge on those 562/560 's is a real advantage .
Efco..no real knowledge on them .
You want new, small, modern spring AV and cheeper (not 242 xp shape ).... il chuck in a curve ball for you, Dolmar ps-35 ....
you want more saw then Ps-421 . How much you want to play around with the saws might be a deciding factor but the Dolmar saws hit high comp from factory so are peppy stock ...ps 35 on left..ps 421 (we have the 420..same saw) right . All ..IMO ..of corse .

Do they have a cylinder split at the right place? Whats the weight on those. The PS 35 looks smaller. I like that.

 

[Spike60]

I'm already there with 550 as my OMS (old man saw) entry. Did my usual un-sophisticated mods and it bested a couple of saws that had some extensive work done to them. It can be seen in the "mini GTG October 2017" that we did several weeks ago. Not sure if Walt's OMS was ready that day or not. A good 50cc with 18" .325 can keep me in firewood for life. Granted we all have to reach for a larger saw at some point as the wood gets bigger, but a saw like that 550 would handle the majority of what I run into. Plenty for most firewood logs, and I can break down tops all day with something that light. For me the OMS target was the least weight that would cover the most ground, so that 550 or my 2150/53 both hit that sweet spot.

 

[Simondo]

Do they have a cylinder split at the right place? Whats the weight on those. The PS 35 looks smaller. I like that.

Nether are that big but the 35 is smaller . They both have a easy start pull start (not like the stihl sort) high comp and no de comp. Ps-35 has a micro 2 part crank case that stays in the saw if you just want to pop the cylinder off ..(see pic )
Ps 421 is just like any other full mag case saw .