Another welder

[Bill G]

Is this a limiting factor? 50 amp welding plug 6-50p. What is the next step-up plug for Amps greater then 50?

View attachment 460733

That is the correct plug.

 

[Bill G]

I know. Just seems radical going from 60 to 90. But if the wire can handle it, then why not. BUT if all that being true why was the circuit originally wired for greater current, but only a 60 Amp breaker was installed? I'm no electrician, and think about this for a while before jumping.

What size wire is running from the meter to the breaker panel?

 

[OnlyStihl]

What size wire is running from the meter to the breaker panel?

2 AWG copper.

O

Post in thread 'Another welder'

Apr 20, 2025

Pulled the panel for the home wiring. To the garage the pair of cables is 2AWG which can support 95Amps. The wire from the street is (my guess) twice as thick (or really really thick). I'm going to pick up a heavier duty breaker for the main breaker panel. Looks like I have more than enough capacity to use the IdealArc at full power.

And I tried several times to call the utility company and ask about the service. The wait was endless and I gave up after 10 minutes or so, and after multiple attempts said F'It.

• OnlyStihl

• 

 

[Junk Meister]

2 AWG copper.

View attachment 460807

O

Post in thread 'Another welder'

Apr 20, 2025

Pulled the panel for the home wiring. To the garage the pair of cables is 2AWG which can support 95Amps. The wire from the street is (my guess) twice as thick (or really really thick). I'm going to pick up a heavier duty breaker for the main breaker panel. Looks like I have more than enough capacity to use the IdealArc at full power.

And I tried several times to call the utility company and ask about the service. The wait was endless and I gave up after 10 minutes or so, and after multiple attempts said F'It.

• OnlyStihl

• 

Utility companies have a different book of standards (So I Hear) before the weather head (Overhead service) NEC takes over after that and dictates details like grounding/bonding insulation, conduit size/fill different states have different requirements but the NEC is the basic cornerstone

 

[OnlyStihl]

Utility companies have a different book of standards (So I Hear) before the weather head (Overhead service) NEC takes over after that and dictates details like grounding/bonding insulation, conduit size/fill different states have different requirements but the NEC is the basic cornerstone

There are many many exceptions to most all accepted truths. All one can do is take it all in, understand it as best one can, and leave a margin for error.

The problem comes when you are a new homeowner buying someone else's problem. When I bought my place the previous bidders had a home inspection, before not being able to secure a loan. I got a copy of the inspection report, and there were things like the aerator on the bathroom faucet is slightly clogged. *** Gosh *** Really? Like anybody could see that by turning on the faucet. I highly doubt this so called "Inspector (it's a scam)" was pulling the breaker panel cover and measuring the AWG vs the breaker rating.

 

[Bill G]

Does the service also feed your home?
What is the minimum the power company will allow on a new install or remodel?

 

[OnlyStihl]

Does the service also feed your home?
What is the minimum the power company will allow on a new install or remodel?

20A 240V breaker into the house. It also acts as a service disrupt. Not sure how that works, 20A is the main feeding to the house, 20A to the water pump and currently the 60A breaker to the garage.

 

[Bill G]

Can you take some pictures of your meter base and the path through

 

[thompsoncustom]

I'm wondering if it's the welder and not the breaker. I can run 180amps on my stick and not pop a 40amp breaker.

 

[OnlyStihl]

I'm wondering if it's the welder and not the breaker. I can run 180amps on my stick and not pop a 40amp breaker.

What brand/model of welder is this? I have for sale a Century AC230, and back when it was my main welder, I had it at full power (230 Amps), and it burned rods with less intensity then the IdealArc set at 125Amps.

From the plate on the back, the IdealArc draws 55 Amps at 200. At 180 it would blow your 40Amp breaker. That does not mean there is something wrong with the welder. It is a completely different animal.

 

[OnlyStihl]

I am finally going to break down and buy a new multimeter. A proper one with a high amp clamp built in. For a DIY garage guy it is amazing how often I use my cheapo digital multimeter. But lately the lack of a proper easy to use amp meter is holding me back.

Looking at Kleins Tools -- anything I should pay attention to?

https://www.amazon.com/Klein-Tools-CL120KIT-Electrical-Auto-Ranging/dp/B08DSX4B27/ref=sr_1_4_mod_primary_new?crid=1V13TF8TBWK6I&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.Zi4oDsiXzOAiS06s3i500GcGL-MNce0B6D7xVpi6G_s3adVmpXXw0EbojCzuwYBOgUsEkIoxukDCVuUFGPTdex6fHpOV8bXz9nZ2IovpJksZkxiW67450EzDF7lQVL8YE1WB6C7zw0lkQOEiF89vlL2mYOAGi53hr6aDPB5_bo9wPAvHc0ouhpyGNaehFvrX95s8vMO2SSjzDMlKX3S-SV-hW3oxqTbos4xpHg8nNwo.zzBLVLyswIFRs_Ud2DOwpwOZjJ-oseqse0TtSdN-3FQ&dib_tag=se&keywords=Klein+Tools+CL120+Digital+Clamp+Meter&qid=1748612692&sbo=RZvfv%2F%2FHxDF%2BO5021pAnSA%3D%3D&sprefix=klein+tools+cl120+digital+clamp+meter%2Caps%2C171&sr=8-4

 

[lehman live edge slab]

What brand/model of welder is this? I have for sale a Century AC230, and back when it was my main welder, I had it at full power (230 Amps), and it burned rods with less intensity then the IdealArc set at 125Amps.

From the plate on the back, the IdealArc draws 55 Amps at 200. At 180 it would blow your 40Amp breaker. That does not mean there is something wrong with the welder. It is a completely different animal.

View attachment 460870

Actually true input amperage and output amperage do correlate in equal terms for the most part long as welder designs are same vs inverters ect. Different designs have different efficiencies but I just know the basics because I’m not an electrician. I agree that something could be wrong with the welder and you could definitely not see it just by looking. If it keeps popping breakers something is up at 125 amps output. Could even be that your were welding more at 150-175 even though dial said 125. I’ve welded with old miller 8 packs you had to turn the dial around 2-3 times fully to gain any heat because it was messed up.

 

[OnlyStihl]

Actually true input amperage and output amperage do correlate in equal terms for the most part long as welder designs are same vs inverters ect. Different designs have different efficiencies but I just know the basics because I’m not an electrician. I agree that something could be wrong with the welder and you could definitely not see it just by looking. If it keeps popping breakers something is up at 125 amps output. Could even be that your were welding more at 150-175 even though dial said 125. I’ve welded with old miller 8 packs you had to turn the dial around 2-3 times fully to gain any heat because it was messed up.

The IdealArc welder retails for $6000, vs an old style relatively inexpensive Buzz box that have the "same" output. What's the difference? Efficiency! Least that is my theory. I'm going to finally answer that question for myself once the Amp Clamp meter from Amazon arrives. Other than the breaker popping once, all indications are that the Welder is okay. Another thing -- the breaker that popped is at the meter box, NOT the breaker for the welder.

Could something be wrong with the IdealArc? I suppose, but it seems highly presumptuous to seize upon that as the problem right out of the gate.

One thing that tells me there is a big difference in welder efficiency is the range of recommended settings as printed on the welding rod package. Why the range? Cause not all welders are equal. Again, that is my theory.

 

[Bill G]

Not all weldors are equal either.......
The most high tech, high dollar, fancy pantsy welder in the world does not produce a quality weld without a quality weldor.

You can give me the best damn TIG unit made and I will produce the worst quality weld ever made.

 

[OnlyStihl]

Not all weldors are equal either.......
The most high tech, high dollar, fancy pantsy welder in the world does not produce a quality weld without a quality weldor.

You can give me the best damn TIG unit made and I will produce the worst quality weld ever made.

I'm completely self-taught. My first welding attempt was a string of BBs over a 4 inch length. I didn't know what setting, didn't know about travel speed, didn't know to clean the metal, couldn't or with great difficulty get an arc started. I made ever rookie mistake, and maybe even invented a few. I discovered over some time a 101 ways to make lousy ugly welds. And I did this all blind as a bat, til someone told me about auto-darkening helmets. I could write a book "How NOT to Weld", if my memory was better. At least I knew to keep trying, and not to buy some fancy pantsy welder.

 

[Bill G]

I do not believe there is an issue with the welder. I really would like to how your wiring is from the weather head to the meter, then to the main, and then to the welder. I have never tripped a main breaker. That indicates something failed between it and the load. Years ago when we still had old 60 amp services they had two cartridge fuses below the meter on the pole. You would burn one ever once in awhile but tripping a main breaker makes me think it is time for a major restructuring.

 

[el33t]

I know. Just seems radical going from 60 to 90. But if the wire can handle it, then why not. BUT if all that being true why was the circuit originally wired for greater current, but only a 60 Amp breaker was installed? I'm no electrician, and think about this for a while before jumping.

A fuse size of 70 is recommended for this welder at 200 A output and 50% duty cycle. The fuse should be “super lag”. Of course, if you are using a circuit breaker it should have the right characteristics to avoid tripping when switching on. These values assume that you have power factor correction capacitors. Without them, the recommended fuse size is 90.

 

[OnlyStihl]

I do not believe there is an issue with the welder. I really would like to how your wiring is from the weather head to the meter, then to the main, and then to the welder. I have never tripped a main breaker. That indicates something failed between it and the load. Years ago when we still had old 60 amp services they had two cartridge fuses below the meter on the pole. You would burn one ever once in awhile but tripping a main breaker makes me think it is time for a major restructuring.

I don't have a theory either, other than the breaker is going bad. The welder does draw a lot of power even when not under load. Yet when I went to stress test it the following day and ran the power up to 120Amps all was good. IDK, but I'm swapping out the breaker for something more, something I was planning to do so anyways.

All I can do is beef up the system that is a bit light for this big welder and carry on and see what happens next. I'll make some measurements with the Amp clamp and see how taxed the current system is.

 

[OnlyStihl]

A fuse size of 70 is recommended for this welder at 200 A output and 50% duty cycle. The fuse should be “super lag”. Of course, if you are using a circuit breaker it should have the right characteristics to avoid tripping when switching on. These values assume that you have power factor correction capacitors. Without them, the recommended fuse size is 90.

Got the PF. I doubt I'll ever run this at 200. 120 was intense. More heat than I have ever seen or witnessed. If I do it will be to satisfy a curiosity.

 

[Al Smith]

For this conversaion most of the time a 200 amp machine will meet the needs of most welders .usually ran at 100-120 amps and only very rarely ever ran at 200 .Then only iron powder flux 5/32" 7024 rods which very few people use .One of the most iconic engine driven machines is the SA 200 Lincoln.Those old duffers have built a lot of buildings welded a lot of pipelines and are still used today ,200 amp . BTW I own one so old it's a crank start .