What oil is best? and what ratio?

[bwalker]

Me either. In fact I want to know. But I also want to know why, and to be shown. Then I've learned and I can grow from it.


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I politely suggested many times going back many pages that running boat oils and castor oils isn't the best idea. You can lead a horse to water,but you can't make them drink.

 

[paragonbuilder]

Keith, don't be gullable. I have never had a oil related failure, ever. That doesn't mean all oils are good.
That also doesn't mean that I am going to run the wrong type of oil in my motors searching for a failure.

If you've never had a failure from oil, ever! Then what makes it wrong oil? If it works, lubes the motor sufficiently, and prevents engine failure, then how is it wrong. The manufacturers don't want us modifying the motors either, so I guess that's wrong too...



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[sawmikaze]

No need for us to get upset and insult each other, we are all different and want and need different things. Everyone can't be like each other, what a boring world it would be with no diversity. cause people are different is why we have a huge choice in products. Thank goodness for Divergence.

Then why do you guys cut me up about the way my pretty smile looks ?

 

[junkman]

I politely suggested many times going back many pages that running boat oils and castor oils isn't the best idea. You can lead a horse to water,but you can't make them drink.

This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ if the bottle says castor or tcw on the label do not run in a saw ,very easy

 

[paragonbuilder]

I'm guessing any of the 2 stroke oils made today are better than running sae30 like we did way back. And that worked too...


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[jmssaws]

I'm guessing any of the 2 stroke oils made today are better than running sae30 like we did way back. And that worked too...


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I got a 20 year old bottle of sunoco I use for assembly lube and I've ran some of it in a pinch. It's bright green and delicious.

 

[bwalker]

If you've never had a failure from oil, ever! Then what makes it wrong oil? If it works, lubes the motor sufficiently, and prevents engine failure, then how is it wrong. The manufacturers don't want us modifying the motors either, so I guess that's wrong too...



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So the litmus test for a good oil is "it doesn't cause failure?" If that's the case hy-tran mixed with your fuel won't cause your engine to seize immediately.
The real question should be what type of oil does the mfg reccomend and what's the best oil of that type.

 

[bwalker]

This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ if the bottle says castor or tcw on the label do not run in a saw ,very easy

Exactly! Although you have to look out for "gerlneral purpose" too. Anytging that saws it's ok to use in a boat motor yiu don't want to use.
I bought a fishing lodge once which ran everything from pick trucks to fourwheelers to OPE on 50:1 tcw3 premix. The OPE looked terrible. The fourstrokes sucked it down just fine though!

 

[paragonbuilder]

So the litmus test for a good oil is "it doesn't cause failure?" If that's the case hy-tran mixed with your fuel won't cause your engine to seize immediately.
The real question should be what type of oil does the mfg reccomend and what's the best oil of that type.

No, but I think that it's not always the only way. We modify engines. They don't recommend that. It seems that some are running the wrong oils and for a long time with no detrimental effects. So are they wrong?


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[paragonbuilder]

Exactly! Although you have to look out for "gerlneral purpose" too. Anytging that saws it's ok to use in a boat motor yiu don't want to use.
I bought a fishing lodge once which ran everything from pick trucks to fourwheelers to OPE on 50:1 tcw3 premix. The OPE looked terrible. The fourstrokes sucked it down just fine though!

What did it do to the OPE?


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[bwalker]

I got a 20 year old bottle of sunoco I use for assembly lube and I've ran some of it in a pinch. It's bright green and delicious.

Anymore I only put a small bit of lube on the bearings and leave the piston/rings/cylinder dry.

 

[jmssaws]

I mostly oil the crank and big end bearing. After brake clean the oil is stripped. The piston is lubed immediately but the bearings could take a second.

 

[bwalker]

No, but I think that it's not always the only way. We modify engines. They don't recommend that. It seems that some are running the wrong oils and for a long time with no detrimental effects. So are they wrong?


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Modification of a motor doesn't change what the oil reccomendations are based on. If anything it makes the use of the proper oil more important.

 

[junkman]

What did it do to the OPE?


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I bet it turned to black goo from running at the wrong temp it was made for .

 

[bwalker]

X,,

What did it do to the OPE?


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Nasty carbon build up in the exhaust ports and ring grooves. One saw, a Jonsered 2149 actually had stuck ring. All of the equipment had spooge drooling out the exhaust and nasty spark screens.

 

[bwalker]

I bet it turned to black goo from running at the wrong temp it was made for .

Marine oil is ment to burn at much higher load, steady throttle and lower internal temps. As a result it uses ashless nitrogen based dispersents vs the mettalic based detergents used in aircooled oil. It also uses alot more heavy oil to deal with the high loads and the fact that marine oils can't contain mettalics. This leads to the nasty deposits and poor combustion.
The OPE world is slow. In the snowmobile world it was settled that running tcw3 type oils was a bad thing in the 90's. Of course that industry had the travesty of the mfg's briefly reccomend in the use of tcw3 oils. It worked out very poorly for them and they rather quickly switched back to the use of API TC air cooled type oils.

 

[paragonbuilder]

X,,

Nasty carbon build up in the exhaust ports and ring grooves. One saw, a Jonsered 2149 actually had stuck ring. All of the equipment had spooge drooling out the exhaust and nasty spark screens.

Thank you, I will look for these effects on my OPE.


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[paragonbuilder]

Marine oil is ment to burn at much higher load, steady throttle and lower internal temps. As a result it uses ashless nitrogen based dispersents vs the mettalic based detergents used in aircooled oil. It also uses alot more heavy oil to deal with the high loads and the fact that marine oils can't contain mettalics. This leads to the nasty deposits and poor combustion.
The OPE world is slow. In the snowmobile world it was settled that running tcw3 type oils was a bad thing in the 90's. Of course that industry had the travesty of the mfg's briefly reccomend in the use of tcw3 oils. It worked out very poorly for them and they rather quickly switched back to the use of API TC air cooled type oils.

Thank you for the explanation. This helps...


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[junkman]

It seems an oil made for oil injection would be thinner also than a pre-mix oil ,which would make the ope run richer than it was designed for, also leaving a lot of unburnt buildup around the exhaust port and other areas .

 

[Keith Gandy]

Keith, don't be gullable. I have never had a oil related failure, ever. That doesn't mean all oils are good.
That also doesn't mean that I am going to run the wrong type of oil in my motors searching for a failure.

I was referring to the Klotz oil he has used for years ? Do I think any harm will come from running that Vavoline or RP in saws? Definetely not. I choose not to run tcw3 in my saws as its very thin oil and I care more about protection than i do performance. Plenty of people on here thats ran tcw3 oils in their equipment with 0 issues. Redbull and Treemonkey seem to like the Schaffers tcw3 with no issues?