Dogging in vs self feeding - Tooth length too! The truth of it.

[Philbert]

Some of the ‘I saw it on the Internet’ guys have taken: ‘It’s POSSIBLE to run uneven cutters (by compensating with a progressive depth gauge tool)’, to, ‘It makes NO DIFFERENCE’.

Not the same thing.

Philbert

 

[ferris]

As others said, looks about right for stock 660... its always fun to do mods and get more out of it... this is my 661 with mild porting, .0205 squish, modded muffler and no timing advance in rock maple with a hard nosr bar, so loosing some efficiency there...

I would say ur chain is a little bit too tight for a hardnose bar. U can see that in the beginning of the video. Chain stops immediately when u left the trigger

 

[Jethro 2t sniffer]

@Jethro 2t sniffer whats your recipe for sharpening? You cut alot of Australian wood.

Better late than never I don't count strokes I file until its sharp and straight. I hog out the gullet a little with a few strokes first. I file 1 handed and hold the bar with the other. Stihl chain. I hate stihl as a company but dang nice chain

The rakers get hit with the husky depth gauge majiggy on the low setting for soft wood and often get a couple strokes lower than that maybe 4 for pine and firewooding. Felling no. I like a high setting or in between slightly and same setting for hard nasty old bluegum (the aussie wood) generally the bluegum I'm cutting is green and cuts nice. Old dead standing can be really knarly and hammers at the corners on full chisel

 

[Junk Meister]

That’s how chaps work: they stall out momentum. No rotation; no spark generated; motor stops.

Higher torque saw, or less aggressive cutter profile, might have bounced, or kept going ?

Philbert

Wish there was an "ATTA BOY" icon. Replies like This Makes reading older posts "TITILLATING"

 

[rogue60]

As others said, looks about right for stock 660... its always fun to do mods and get more out of it... this is my 661 with mild porting, .0205 squish, modded muffler and no timing advance in rock maple with a hard nosr bar, so loosing some efficiency there...

That's slow as and the hard nose bar has nothing to do with it. The chain is lacking big time and as others have said is way over tight for a hard nose bar.

Here's couple vids .404 RS hard nose bars in Aussie hardwoods.
Makes me laugh when I read hard nose bars are for stumping or dirty timber on the internet's by guys that have never used em before lol
Tallowwood

Narrow leaf red ironbark

 

[Maintenance Chief]

That's slow as and the hard nose bar has nothing to do with it. The chain is lacking big time and as others have said is way over tight for a hard nose bar.

Here's couple vids .404 RS hard nose bars in Aussie hardwoods.
Makes me laugh when I read hard nose bars are for stumping or dirty timber on the internet's by guys that have never used em before lol

If you think about it, the popular Bow Bar here in the southern us is a hard nose bar.

 

[Maintenance Chief]

 

[rogue60]

Blue Gum is not a hard hardwood as far as Aussie hardwoods go. Take a rolled up foam mattress like White Oak well Blue Gum is way softer than that lol
I've cut just about every Aussie hardwood species there is.
Never in my 50years have I experienced an Aussie hardwood timber so hard it knocks off/ smashes the leading corner of Stihl RS chain off! It dulls evenly across the cutter edge in clean timber.
Contaminated timber with dirt/sand/rocks or ploughing the nose into the dirt is what's responsible for the smashed/destroyed leading corner of RS chain.

 

[rogue60]

Back to you were saying about equal cutter lengths. I see that having that different lengths work for guys on the internet but in dry hardwood it doesn't seem to work.

If you have 1 short cutter, the next in line behind it gets the corner knocked off it quickly. The chain still cuts fine so you keep going. When it's time to sharpen now you have a cutter with a lot of damage and the following one has taken a beating as well, so you file them back.

Now you have 2 that are very short and a 3rd that's in between. You go cut again and the cycle repeats, the short ones look ok but the mid length one is hammered and so is the next one behind it. This keep happening and you get a short life from the chain.

It's due to the side plate tapering inwards. You can compensate for the height difference between the cutters with the depth gauge but can't compensate for the reduced width. This doesn't appear to be an issue when cutting green or softer woods.

When I cut for a living I use to break out the damaged cutters and replace them. I would throw the damaged sections in a bucket and keep them for matching up to other damaged chains later on. It was more cost effective than wearing out a chain sooner than expected.

After watching a bunch of sharpening videos on YouTube I'm being to wonder if people get away with doing this because they remove so much every time they sharpen. Guys seem to love going to town with the file and taking out a heap of the tooth every time. If they only get 7 or 8 sharpenings out of a chain they probably never have an issue with this.

I try to sharpen small amounts often. A few swipes after a tank of fuel works better for me than going until it won't cut them hacking off a heap of metal.

Yeah it's called SET left and right.
Many can't grasp how inefficient a chain is with cutters all different lengths and it's not something you can get away with as the hardness of timber increases if an efficient chain is the goal.
A short cutter does less work than a long cutter on a chain with cutters all over the place.
A long cutter does more work it has to clean out the narrower kerf left behind by the shorter cutter's it's not rocket science to understand this.
But yeah the softer the timber the more sloppiness in sharpening one can get away with.. And besides a famous you tuber that cuts timber the hardness of styrofoam said cutter length all over the place don't matter for everyone on the planet so must be true lol

 

[rogue60]

Actually I take that back appears Blue Gum is harder than White Oak any wonder you guys struggle with it lol

 

[IffykidMn]

Actually I take that back appears Blue Gum is harder than White Oak any wonder you guys struggle with it lol
View attachment 410852

That is kind of interesting I always thought White Oak cut easy but I run random length cutters and a progressive depth gauge on a 90cc saw and 24" b&c and started doing so before the internet became a thing.

 

[rogue60]

That is kind of interesting I always thought White Oak cut easy but I run random length cutters and a progressive depth gauge on a 90cc saw and 24" b&c and started doing so before the internet became a thing.

Yeah I believe softer timbers are more forgiving when it comes to sharpening and mismatched cutter lengths with different set.
Our native Cypress Pine is around the same janka hardness as White Oak which blows my mind yeah we don't have much in the way of speed wood lol

 

[Jethro 2t sniffer]

To be honest most of us stupid kiwi's call any aussie tree bluegum well around here anyway.

If they have access to water they are soft as and grow stupid fast like 35 inch tree in 25 years fast. Then again what species? No idea but a gum tree of some description.

Some are red inside. The dead ones wouldn't have a clue half the time as they are by themselves and no leaves

This here was stupid hard and ripped off cutters at like a 3rd left. Not done yet but yeah not new
Was years ago now. It had been dead standing for 20 years atleast


Also cut a bit of jarrah from time to time just from posts poles and off the warf. The jarrah was nothing to whatever that random old tree was.

But no we really don't have sod all experience in my region of stupid hard aussie wood but do get the odd 1

 

[Squareground3691]

To be honest most of us stupid kiwi's call any aussie tree bluegum well around here anyway.

If they have access to water they are soft as and grow stupid fast like 35 inch tree in 25 years fast. Then again what species? No idea but a gum tree of some description.

Some are red inside. The dead ones wouldn't have a clue half the time as they are by themselves and no leaves

This here was stupid hard and ripped off cutters at like a 3rd left. Not done yet but yeah not newView attachment 410877
Was years ago now. It had been dead standing for 20 years atleast


Also cut a bit of jarrah from time to time just from posts poles and off the warf. The jarrah was nothing to whatever that random old tree was.

But no we really don't have sod all experience in my region of stupid hard aussie wood but do get the odd 1

Curious what brand chain you use, ?

 

[Jethro 2t sniffer]

Stihl nowadays. Looking back the cutters that I've broken were oregon or carlton. I don't care for those chains now. Not bothering at all

 

[Squish9]

Makes me laugh when I read hard nose bars are for stumping or dirty timber on the internet's by guys that have never used em before lol

I started running hard nose bars after having a few stringy barks jamming up a couple of sprockets. I can't tell the difference on the big saws and it doesn't seem to hurt the small saws either.

Dcs460 with a 16 hard nose.

 

[davidwyby]

I need a Janka tester

 

[davidwyby]

Pine is a softwood…but it’s not always a soft wood.

 

[rogue60]

Yeach with a

To be honest most of us stupid kiwi's call any aussie tree bluegum well around here anyway.

If they have access to water they are soft as and grow stupid fast like 35 inch tree in 25 years fast. Then again what species? No idea but a gum tree of some description.

Some are red inside. The dead ones wouldn't have a clue half the time as they are by themselves and no leaves

This here was stupid hard and ripped off cutters at like a 3rd left. Not done yet but yeah not newView attachment 410877
Was years ago now. It had been dead standing for 20 years atleast


Also cut a bit of jarrah from time to time just from posts poles and off the warf. The jarrah was nothing to whatever that random old tree was.

But no we really don't have sod all experience in my region of stupid hard aussie wood but do get the odd

Yeah with about 800 species of eucalypt who knows.
Some dodgy seed collecting and selling went on also ya didn't always get what was promised. California is a prime example of this with some of the worst examples of Aussie hardwoods on the planet absolute terrible seed where ever they got it lol
The forestry here collect seed from the best big healthy examples of whatever species they are needing for future mill logs.

 

[rogue60]

I need a Janka tester

I'm sure it wouldn't be hard to find the testing specifications and make ya own tester. My understanding is all they do is press a steel ball bearing into timber measuring the force it takes.