What's on your bench?

[walterg]

Tore my Homelite XL 12 all the way down. Going to need new rings, but I think I can save the cylinder and piston.
Bad news is the coil ground a groove in the flywheel. Flywheel is trash.
If I can get the drive rivets out that hold the coil in place, and replace them with machine screws and nuts, I might be able to save it. The coil right now has over 1/8" play.



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[walterg]

Today I had three saws on the bench.
Two Wild Thing's, and a Poulan Pro 295.
1st Wild Thing just needs a fuel line, carb kit, proper tune, and some cleaning. I don't like dirty saws.
2nd Wild thing and the 295 I need to check out fully. Not sure what the issue is with them.

Was also working on a Husqvarna 6021p push mower. This one just needs a new carb.

All these belong to my neighbor. Just trying to help him out.

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[usmcbuckwild]

As stated in the Dolmar thread, I test drove the 7900 today. Brand new Sugi 28” reduced weight bar, brand new 72LGX chain on ported (by me) oem p/c with BGD and stock numbers, muffler mod (opened up the internal baffle and matched the opening to 100% of stock deflector) I also happened to end up with a couple rolls of the reflective heat tape used on CH-53E helos, so I lined the case under the muffler and the entire interior of the cyl cover. In theory this should help keep paint from turning colors, allow the airflow under the cover to be smoother and keep the heat where it should be.



And of course I find some metal in this damned tree with the brand new bar and chain.

 

[Moparmyway]

I don't doubt that, but I think you are missing something I said. I think it depends on the saw, and porting on that saw.

I think it is a mistake to presume that because far more muffler opening worked on one saw that it will work on all of them. IMO, it is more likely to work on a ported saw, and less likely on a non ported one. I also think the timing #s play a role.

And not that I like to quote that AH (starts with a J), but he said that some of his saws lost power if the muffler was opened too much.

I think you are judging too quickly.

The Cross MMWS cylinders on my Asian twins were as close to identical as any two cylinders (OEM or AM) I have ever seen (my other two Cross cylinders were both different than these and themselves). I think these two were made back to back.

The only difference in assembly was the muffler baffle and outlet. Twin 2 was more aggressive, and I expected it to run stronger. When I put them both to wood, I was pleased with Twin 1, but not Twin 2.

Although about everyone told me it was not the muffler, I ordered another one and modded it less. I am now very happy with how Twin #2 runs. Don't know what else to say.

Mike, I like you , so please dont take this wrong ................ here goes
Tune is everything
you have said here before that you tune to a certain rpm
Thats not the way to find the most power in a saw
I dont believe that the results you get are wrong, but I do believe you go about it wrong, and get the wrong results.
Tune your saw in the wood for max rpm, with a tach.
You will see a difference.
Ask anyone that was at the Ct GTG ............ everyone except Dan thought my muffler modded new 395 was ported
It only had a HUGE bulls nose muffler mod.
It idled fine, didnt hesitate when you nailed it, and had mounds more power than a stock 395 ......... heck, it was just behind the ported ones.

I did that (along with running 12.5:1) on purpose. That purpose was to have guys wake up to the internet crap that they have been chewing on for too long.

So what happens when you cant adjust out the carb with a big muffler mod ?
You need more fuel, thats what.

PM me for more if you want Mike, but you can't just close off to changing one thing when you have left soooo much on the table

Could of gone bigger.

I tried, but I think keeping the brake operational was the best way.
I am considering cutting and TIG welding something on the other side ......... going to have to play with that brake handle to do it though

Kevin, if I had the talent, I'd make em like that! But seriously, some tests would be nice.

And don't you think those tests have already been done ?

Why would anyone go through the pain of splitting a NOS 395 muffler, cutting out the baffles, TIG welding on TWO 1.25" outlets and TIG welding the muffler back together ............. then bring that contraption (without timing advance or porting) to a GTG and tell everyone to run it with 404 and an 8 tooth on a 25" setup ?

Tests have been done Mike ............ you have a group of guys that you can ask, you have a bunch of resources at your fingertips ............. why are you believing the myth ?

 

[Dub11]

Mike, I like you , so please dont take this wrong ................ here goes
Tune is everything
you have said here before that you tune to a certain rpm
Thats not the way to find the most power in a saw
I dont believe that the results you get are wrong, but I do believe you go about it wrong, and get the wrong results.
Tune your saw in the wood for max rpm, with a tach.
You will see a difference.
Ask anyone that was at the Ct GTG ............ everyone except Dan thought my muffler modded new 395 was ported
It only had a HUGE bulls nose muffler mod.
It idled fine, didnt hesitate when you nailed it, and had mounds more power than a stock 395 ......... heck, it was just behind the ported ones.

I did that (along with running 12.5:1) on purpose. That purpose was to have guys wake up to the internet crap that they have been chewing on for too long.

So what happens when you cant adjust out the carb with a big muffler mod ?
You need more fuel, thats what.

PM me for more if you want Mike, but you can't just close off to changing one thing when you have left soooo much on the table



I tried, but I think keeping the brake operational was the best way.
I am considering cutting and TIG welding something on the other side ......... going to have to play with that brake handle to do it though

I was only playing on the size.

 

[usmcbuckwild]

Mike, I like you , so please dont take this wrong ................ here goes
Tune is everything
you have said here before that you tune to a certain rpm
Thats not the way to find the most power in a saw
I dont believe that the results you get are wrong, but I do believe you go about it wrong, and get the wrong results.
Tune your saw in the wood for max rpm, with a tach.
You will see a difference.
Ask anyone that was at the Ct GTG ............ everyone except Dan thought my muffler modded new 395 was ported
It only had a HUGE bulls nose muffler mod.
It idled fine, didnt hesitate when you nailed it, and had mounds more power than a stock 395 ......... heck, it was just behind the ported ones.

I did that (along with running 12.5:1) on purpose. That purpose was to have guys wake up to the internet crap that they have been chewing on for too long.

So what happens when you cant adjust out the carb with a big muffler mod ?
You need more fuel, thats what.

PM me for more if you want Mike, but you can't just close off to changing one thing when you have left soooo much on the table



I tried, but I think keeping the brake operational was the best way.
I am considering cutting and TIG welding something on the other side ......... going to have to play with that brake handle to do it though

What if you cut the angle down on the pipe where it meets the plate? This will give you a larger overall opening and will allow you to open up more of the muffler. Plus, it will make the exhaust pipe/deflector lower profile and reduce interference with the brake.

 

[usmcbuckwild]

I was only playing on the size.

Size queen?

 

[Dub11]

Size queen?

Not really.

Saws are already to loud and scary, so why make them louder.

 

[Moparmyway]

What if you cut the angle down on the pipe where it meets the plate? This will give you a larger overall opening and will allow you to open up more of the muffler. Plus, it will make the exhaust pipe/deflector lower profile and reduce interference with the brake.

Possible ........ however, at the end of the pipe, with this example, its still just a 1.25" opening, no matter how much we expose to the inside of the muffler can. At some point, the weakest link is what must be overcome. A bit more angle with a 1.5" pipe is what I will try to do next.

The other thing that I try to keep in mind is the exhaust coming back at the operator.

Its nice to open the muffler and get more power, this is true ........... it's even nicer to get more power and breathe cleaner air, for both the operator and the air going into the saw. To this effect, lately, I've tried to deflect the exhaust away from the cutting area and get good gains on the muffler mod, while keeping the brake operational. This is where I feel that the 395 is just above the rest. It has the best layout to really open up everything and keep the brake operational ......... all without melting plastics or getting dirty exhaust stains everywhere

 

[usmcbuckwild]

Not really.

Saws are already to loud and scary, so why make them louder.

I was just kidding

 

[usmcbuckwild]

Possible ........ however, at the end of the pipe, with this example, its still just a 1.25" opening, no matter how much we expose to the inside of the muffler can. At some point, the weakest link is what must be overcome. A bit more angle with a 1.5" pipe is what I will try to do next.

The other thing that I try to keep in mind is the exhaust coming back at the operator.

Its nice to open the muffler and get more power, this is true ........... it's even nicer to get more power and breathe cleaner air, for both the operator and the air going into the saw. To this effect, lately, I've tried to deflect the exhaust away from the cutting area and get good gains on the muffler mod, while keeping the brake operational. This is where I feel that the 395 is just above the rest. It has the best layout to really open up everything and keep the brake operational ......... all without melting plastics or getting dirty exhaust stains everywhere
View attachment 122652 View attachment 122653 View attachment 122654

Possible ........ however, at the end of the pipe, with this example, its still just a 1.25" opening, no matter how much we expose to the inside of the muffler can. At some point, the weakest link is what must be overcome. A bit more angle with a 1.5" pipe is what I will try to do next.

The other thing that I try to keep in mind is the exhaust coming back at the operator.

Its nice to open the muffler and get more power, this is true ........... it's even nicer to get more power and breathe cleaner air, for both the operator and the air going into the saw. To this effect, lately, I've tried to deflect the exhaust away from the cutting area and get good gains on the muffler mod, while keeping the brake operational. This is where I feel that the 395 is just above the rest. It has the best layout to really open up everything and keep the brake operational ......... all without melting plastics or getting dirty exhaust stains everywhere
View attachment 122652 View attachment 122653 View attachment 122654

I like the thinking behind this. Is there any study or method behind the decision making process in location(s) and pipe size or is it more of a ‘seat of the pants dyno’ and experience?

 

[Dub11]

I was just kidding

Oh I've nailed a few poulan mufflers with a uni bit before for the hell of it lol.

Ear muffs are my friend.

 

[Moparmyway]

I like the thinking behind this. Is there any study or method behind the decision making process in location(s) and pipe size or is it more of a ‘seat of the pants dyno’ and experience?

I go by the tach Curt.
It dont care how loud the exhaust is, it tells you how fast that motor is spinning, and it also coinsides with how much you can wrench down on a saw as well.

So, to tell you the truth, I have seen that the bigger the opening, the better the results are.
I have also seen that the cleaner air makes more power, and that same cleaner air makes the cutting more fun, as well as it also keeps the chips and dust outta the operators eyes.


My 661 is just one bad mutha to run. It never fails to put a smile on my face, and it has more grunt than you would think. I'll grab that bulls nose dual pipe outlet 395 over my 661 every day when I am working though. The 661 bounces exhaust and cut chew right into my face, whereas the 395 does the same cutting without even squinting or holding your breath.

I'll be working on getting the 661 exhaust out and away just like the 395 does ............ I hate holding my breath and squinting when I run the 661.

 

[usmcbuckwild]

Oh I've nailed a few poulan mufflers with a uni but for the help of it lol.

Ear muffs are my friend.

What? Can’t hear you!


I have a couple sets of MSA Supreme Pro amplified hearing protection. Hands down absolute favorite for shooting and any loud situations. Full coverage hearing protection that amplify regular sounds so you can maintain normal conversation but automatically instantly mute loud noises to protect hearing. Expensive but worth every penny if you value your hearing.

http://us.msasafety.com/Hearing-Pro...set,-Single-or-Dual-Comm/p/000380014000001049

 

[huskyboy]

I agree with Kevin on the tach that’s what I did when comparing different setups. The rpm it held in cut under a good load is what I paid attention to.

 

[usmcbuckwild]

I agree with Kevin on the tach that’s what I did when comparing different setups. The rpm it held in cut under a good load is what I paid attention to.

I need to get a better tach to do so reliably. That and some better test logs

 

[MustangMike]

Kevin, it is possible the carb could not provide enough fuel, but you got to play with the cards you got. This saw ran better with muffler #2 and I'm happy with how it runs, so it will stay as it is.

A different carb may help, or may not, but I'm not going there. Bottom line, it is a damn good running $300 saw.

I think you maintain more of a race saw mentality, and I maintain more of a work saw mentality.

 

[MustangMike]

I don't believe any 2 aftermarket jugs to be equal. Only way to test is to use the same jug with different muffler.

That is why I changed the muffler on twin #2. Compares two different mufflers on the same jug.

As others have stated, the carb may be the limiting factor, but I don't have the skill or knowledge to mod the carb, so that is off the table. With this carb, it liked muffler #2 better.

 

[Moparmyway]

Kevin, it is possible the carb could not provide enough fuel, but you got to play with the cards you got. This saw ran better with muffler #2 and I'm happy with how it runs, so it will stay as it is.

A different carb may help, or may not, but I'm not going there. Bottom line, it is a damn good running $300 saw.

I'm sure it is a good running saw, but could it be better, and should you make wide ranging statements based on just one "feel of the pants" result where you might not have done everything you could do to achieve the best output ?

Also, who said anything about a different carb ?
Mayhaps that carb has everything you need to proove my point ?

I think you maintain more of a race saw mentality, and I maintain more of a work saw mentality.

As others have stated, the carb may be the limiting factor, but I don't have the skill or knowledge to mod the carb, so that is off the table.

Screetches to a violent halt right here ................

I've seen lazy clapped out saws come alive and turn angry with a little TLC in the carb area ..................

You did learn how to add a dual port muffler, an HD2 air filter, and advance the timing, didnt you ?

 

[MustangMike]

should you make wide ranging statements based on just one "feel of the pants" result

I agree, and I did not think I did, here is what I stated:

"Now I'm not claiming this is a universal thing, but on the saw I have, it worked. (Asian 660 w/Cross P+C w/o base gasket).

My theory, and it is just a theory (I welcome comments both pro + con), is that these saws tend to have a lot of intake (often 82 or more) and that restricting the muffler a bit is keeping more of the charge in the cylinder."