Chain Breakers and making homemade chain

[SimonHS]

I understand the terminology and how it should work!
But, the rivet is thicker in its mid section (where it holds the drive link) - it technically can not be punched out without bending the opposite side tie strap!
Also, how exactly is the anvil supporting and holding the chain level - I looked at it and the rivet doesn't seem to be at the exact same axis as the punch and therefore gets pushed out "crooked"?!
As I said, it all looks weird to me and my breaker & spinner have been collecting dust from day 1 since I purchased them.

The breaker I purchased came with bent OEM punches and a couple chain sections with FAILED breaking attempts.
The previous owner must have tried resizing his own chains and failed.
I made a couple custom punches (some of which with "replaceable" tips) but have yet to give breaking & spinning a try.
I'll get to it, You'll be the first I will turn to for help!

Sometimes it helps to grind the top of the rivet before punching it out, to weaken it.

This video shows a good view of the process.

 

[KS Plainsman]

Check out the Archer Plus website, I found that they seem to be slightly better on pricing, probably due to no Evil Bay fees. There might be other benefits as well.

They're 15 bucks cheaper on their site, but Ebay has free shipping. I looked and didn't see anything about free shipping if ordering off of their site.

Do they charge shipping if ordered directly from their site?

 

[redneckhillbilly]

are the rivet dimensions standarized between the chain sizes, does all .325 chain share the same rivet size?

 

[Wilhelm]

No, differences are present between brands, even same brand but different chain models.

To my understanding You need the exact same master link as Your chain is, or make sure the dimensions match.

But that is merely my understanding of the matter reading posts about it.

 

[Philbert]

I understand the terminology and how it should work!

But, the rivet is thicker in its mid section (where it holds the drive link) - it technically can not be punched out without bending the opposite side tie strap!

Also, how exactly is the anvil supporting and holding the chain level - I looked at it and the rivet doesn't seem to be at the exact same axis as the punch and therefore gets pushed out "crooked"?!

The breaker I purchased came with bent OEM punches and a couple chain sections with FAILED breaking attempts.

I made a couple custom punches (some of which with "replaceable" tips) but have yet to give breaking & spinning a try.

The slotted (or adjustable) anvil, supports the drive link from beneath the chain, allowing the entire bottom tie strap to be pressed off with the rivets.

I have never ground rivet heads off when using my breaker, except with 3/4” harvester chain.

Some light gauge, small pitch (1/4”, 3/8 low profile/narrow-kerf, etc.) chains can get distorted from the pressure, so I may press one rivet part-way out, switch to the other, then finish punching the first.

If you don’t get it centered, the punch may break: they are hard and brittle. That’s why it’s good to choose a brand where replacement punches and spinning anvils are available.

Most of the rivets will be distorted. Many tie straps will be distorted. It’s best to assume that they will not be reusable, although, sometimes they can be saved. I have had chains bind up when reusing a tie strap that “looked“ good. Lesson learned.

Check out the Archer Plus website, I found that they seem to be slightly better on pricing, probably due to no Evil Bay fees. There might be other benefits as well.

The ArcherPlus guys are easy to deal with. Send them a message if you have a question.

wheres a good place to order pre sets and straps?

Please see Post #12.

are the rivet dimensions standarized between the chain sizes, does all .325 chain share the same rivet size?

No.

Many chains use similar pre-sets, except the ones that don’t.

Most STIHL drive links are 0.063” at the top, but may be swaged down to 0.050” or 0.058” at the bottom, so they use the same presets. Oregon uses the same presets for 0.058” and 0.050” chains. Separate presets for 0.063” chains. Narrow-kerf chains are different.

I will try to post an illustration later. If you mostly run one brand and size (pitch and gauge) of chain it is not an issue. If you work on many brands and sizes you quickly learn about differences.

Philbert

 

[redneckhillbilly]

it seems it would be best to wait and see what kind of chain can be had for cheap and than order the necessary pre set and ties for them.

 

[Philbert]

Oregon presets will fit most comparable (same pitch and gauge) Carlton, Tri-link, Archer, etc., chain, as they mostly copied Oregon dimensions. Oregon also used to make all the branded chains for Husqvarna, Makita, Dolmar, McCulloch, Homelite, Echo, etc., so they will likely fit as well.

The 'preset' is just a tie strap with 2 rivets already in place, to make assembly easier:

It can vary in several dimensions:


As noted, some presets fit specific gauges of chain, and others fit multiple gauges, because the drive links on those chains are swaged from a larger size:



It can be difficult to tell different presets apart, without a micrometer / caliper, although, you can always try test fitting them. Once sorted, it is helpful to keep them separated and labeled.




Philbert

 

[ammoaddict]

You won't be disappointed with archerplus. Great guy to deal with. I have purchased several times from them on eBay and Amazon. I didn't know they had their own website now.

 

[BuckthornBonnie]

Oregon presets will fit most comparable (same pitch and gauge) Carlton, Tri-link, Archer, etc., chain, as they mostly copied Oregon dimensions. Oregon also used to make all the branded chains for Husqvarna, Makita, Dolmar, McCulloch, Homelite, Echo, etc., so they will likely fit as well.

The 'preset' is just a tie strap with 2 rivets already in place, to make assembly easier:View attachment 361134

It can vary in several dimensions:
View attachment 361136

As noted, some presets fit specific gauges of chain, and others fit multiple gauges, because the drive links on those chains are swaged from a larger size:

View attachment 361133

It can be difficult to tell different presets apart, without a micrometer / caliper, although, you can always try test fitting them. Once sorted, it is helpful to keep them separated and labeled.

View attachment 361138
View attachment 361139

Philbert

Like Shaun and others, you are also a gift to the saw community.

I’ve spun up dozens of chains from junk that was on its way to the scrap bin. I wouldn’t want to sell them (not always sold on longevity and usually have oddball cutters) but I definitely use the heck out of them myself.

 

[redneckhillbilly]

I ordered a breaker and spinner and some 3/8 presets and straps from archer plus, they shipped it for free, they are definatley a great company to order from, today I'm going to go buy some chain to practice on

 

[Seachaser]

Does Archer presets and straps fit most chains of the same size?

 

[BuckthornBonnie]

Many, yes. There’s no guarantee on a perfect fit for different brands. I just used Archer presets and links to spin up two Blount (possibly Oregon) .325 chains from a leftover roll.
One has to closely inspect and “feel” if the presets are right.
I don’t have a lot of time on Archer presets in other chain, but they’ve held up great for Archer brand.

 

[Seachaser]

Many, yes. There’s no guarantee on a perfect fit for different brands. I just used Archer presets and links to spin up two Blount (possibly Oregon) .325 chains from a leftover roll.
One has to closely inspect and “feel” if the presets are right.
I don’t have a lot of time on Archer presets in other chain, but they’ve held up great for Archer brand.

Thanks!

 

[Al Smith]

I've got a spinner but every so often use the old school method of peening .Like 1/2" chain and 3/8" pico which I don't have a anvils for .I turned some concave punches from grade 8 bolts I use to finish the process that works very well .You can't tell the difference from a spun joint ..

 

[jakethesnake]

I have done all my 404 with a little hammer. I don’t recommend it but I reused the links.

 

[bertfixessome]

Excellent reply from Philbert
The tie straps can also be different widths as well as having different diameter pins
If you use one that is too narrow the result will be the three links will not bend properly so wear the bar prematurely
Too loose is not so much of a problem
Chain by the roll is quite cheap, even top shelf chain like oregon

The other thing to watch is different chains use different gauge if steel for the side plates, cheap chain is usually wider because it is made from a weaker grade of air hardening steel .

If you are going down this path make sure that you chain brake and the front chain guard are in very good condition as chains travel very fast and a broken chain can fly off the bar and wrap around your leg , or delicate parts near the top of your legs .

I cop a pile of abuse from cheap customers when I refuse to sharpen worn out dangerous chain, many of which have only been used once abd have worn to the point of being dangerous to use .
I am sure burried some whee in this forum is a couple of long threads about how to tell if a chain is worn dangerously
Head them lest you have a passion for playing dissabled sport .

FWIW I make around 200 chain loops a year for customers with a Tecoment chain breaker & spinner
The chain breaker comes with replaceable pins of different sizes, make sure you use the right ones and align the pin properly or they will split and become useless .
Also make sure the chain is supported properly or you will deform the side plates of the links you are keeping
The spinner is not so important but the breaker must be bolted down to something very solid .
I am an old fart so the spinner has a ring magnifiny light on an arm over it so I can see clearly what is happening, spinning is a touch harder than it appears to be and you have to be light handed with the pressure anvil or you will split the head of the pin which will eventually break in service

For my breaker, I took a trick from an old motorcycle shop and got a length of 1/2" square bar and drilled 4 holes in it then cut it off so it supports the 3 links flat on the bar .This is a lot easier that messing around with the supplied vice support.
The bike shop owner had drilled the jaws of his vice to take the common motorcycle chains so be laid the chain to be broken along the vice will all c the pins sitting in a hole the used a punch to drive out the pins
The fixed jaw was the same but the holes were very shallow and these were used with a hollowed punch Called a rivet setter to rivet the new joiner


BE very careful if you mix cutters as you can make a chain that grabs hard then goes loose then grabs hard in cycles which will cause the chain to jump off a rim sprocket and makes cutting quite difficult particularly in hardwood.
Had a fencer who brought in a chain like that to be sharpened.
I sold him a file & gave him a copy of the sthil sharpening guide as I have that on file so can print it out for customers .

Good luck with you venture

 

[thedude74]

Angle grinder and a ball peen hammer... Haven't had a failure yet.

 

[mrxlh]

So i had been considering this for a while, stopped by Harbor Freight and picked up their breaker/spinner combo. For $74.99 I’d say it’s a bargain even if Chinese made. Spun up a loop of 28” from 2 16” loops I purchased off here last year or so. Don’t run a 16” bar much so I figured I’d make a spare loop of 28”. I don’t know if I’ll ever buy a 100’ roll of chain, but making up my own bargain shopping will probably save me some money. FWI .050” oregon presets work just fine on Carlton chain.

 

[isaaccarlson]

I have been toying with the idea, but when a roll is just as much as buying the loops, I don't see any advantage.

 

[SimonHS]

I have been toying with the idea, but when a roll is just as much as buying the loops, I don't see any advantage.

You can sometimes pick up part reels of chain and packs of presets and tie straps cheaply on eBay. Better than paying the full retail price.

You can also modify chains with unpopular drive link counts and make them fit your bars. And you can splice in sections of good chain to replace badly damaged cutters.