Tree Felling Technique Thread

[Coltont]

What are you replacing? I've been running them exclusively for 7 years now. I usually buy one a year and sell the old ones off to firewood guys.

As far as how they run- I port em as soon as I get em. And open the muffler wide. Stock I'm not impressed. I've thought about getting the air filter stack set up because it they feel like they need to breathe more. I like stihls too and that's what I started with but the dealer closest to me ran huskys. I kind of just fell into them. The best part is I don't even go to that dealer anymore.

The mufflers and the plastic starter gear that engages when you pull it to start it. On #4 of each. I even set the starter cord first and make sure it's going to catch rite away.

 

[Skeans1]

The mufflers and the plastic starter gear that engages when you pull it to start it. On #4 of each. I even set the starter cord first and make sure it's going to catch rite away.

Of the couple I’ve had only one that needed a muffler after 15 years, I don’t think I’ve ever replaced the starter gear in either the 390 or 385 I’ve had.


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[~WBF]

Yes sir small diameter will make anyone look foolish.

Jacking really isn't all that different from wedging either as far as movement of wood and how much is cut up and when. You can really tell the work wedges do when you've jacked a few trees. You would never set a jack in a tree, get it cut up all the way, and then try to lift it. No friggin way. Little by little. Pump the handle, tap the wedges snug, cut/nip the wood, repeat.

Yes it sure feels like an insult to you ability when you can't wedge a small sapling and you just finished a 5ft spruce. Yes Jacking trees are a different animal than placing a jack and Jacking. There is more to it than people think. Everything about wedging, roping or Jacking has to be done progressively as well as working a felling face. I buried a $4000 modified jack once. It had a two foot aluminum tank on it. Everybody had to do a full BC Fallers 24page evaluation to start the job and the Supervision pushed the other faller off his face and he forgot about it.
The next day he remembered.
Lucky, I finally spotted part of the aluminum tank from a high stump.
Wasn't my fault for once.

 

[Coltont]

Of the couple I’ve had only one that needed a muffler after 15 years, I don’t think I’ve ever replaced the starter gear in either the 390 or 385 I’ve had.


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I had a 385 quite a few years ago, it didnt give me any trouble.

 

[~WBF]

The mufflers and the plastic starter gear that engages when you pull it to start it. On #4 of each. I even set the starter cord first and make sure it's going to catch rite away.

That is just not normal? Never hear of it happen on any Husqavna pro saws. High compression, you may see broken starter pawls if someone doesn't use the decompression.
I guess a would be using the decompression. Who is making these parts? Did you find out? Did you repay for all this? This is crazy. They had a heavier muffler than the 372 and the 372 muffler could rattle loose and never break were as an AM will break if you don see to it ASAP. Parts became cheap on the 372 like the on/off switch and chokes and trigger locks were the problems.

 

[Coltont]

All oem replacement parts. It's a company saw so I pay for nothing. The mufflers crack around the outside of the holes that the internal muffler bolts go in. Then after you run it like that long enough they blow apart behind the muffler bracket.

 

[junkman]

I am not sure how it could ever be a concern on a 30" full length green tree. Anyway I get the point. Why do you want a deep undercut when you are wedging unless they are light without dangerous tops or stubbies when you want to manipulate the weigh and or tip them quicker. It can be OK on bigger green tree if it's really close one way or the other to try and sway the center of gravity your way. If you miss she will kick over quick without too much trouble. Guide lines are 25% target so then consider your situation.
So if you have serious lifting then you are just making your wedging harder or not doable?
I have wedged as many trees from the side as I have from the back. You can do it from the side just 1/4" in from the back on a solid tree at times. That's why I use the k&h 10" mainly and 12" Nothing shorter. They have the rounded head so you can steer them from the corner naturally. Some other brands do too but I prefer them. They get you out of pinches easy. 12" will work when a 10" keeps grabbing your chain when clearance is tight.
You could do your own corner rounding on wedges but...?
I heard you say before that you own some K&H ??
I never have this trouble and haven't since I started using all longer wedges 15 yrs ago with round heads.
You should be able to burry a 10" wedge in a 16" . You can start them sideways right at the very back to hold it then turn it in if you want.



I see an assortment of wedges in which none are lifting wedges. The thicker 12" should be a chasing/ release wedge and the sleek 10" K&H are leading/lifting wedges.
So I would set up my wedges tight together if possible at the back of the tree and the same direction driving in the direction of the fall if it works from your swing point. A lot of people can't get them to rifle straight when only the one side is loading up so they set them with the curvature of the tree. If they are lined up then your swing stays the same. If I want to set two at the back then each wedge goes inside edge to the center so the outside leading edge may be away from the tree yet. Problem is they will take the path of least resistance and want to turn out. So I lightly tap the inside top then start the second one up against it. Just so they stay there and are even and straight then I crack both inside tops together. Two at once stops them from turning in if you hit too far to the inside. Now you have two fences so you don't have to be accurate when adding more as you stay to you inside or wait for the gap to open a bit more.
I carry three 10" and a 12". That's two stacks and one release wedge if needed. If I chase with the 12" then it's placed the furthest away as it will always be higher than the other top and out of the way of the swing to your leading wedges.

The other wedges you have are either 8 or 10" and as thick as the 12" .They are even steeper as they are shorter. It's a bit of a dogs breakfast going on. There is no system here?



As far as the math... Turtle vs hare analogy.
Well you half your back cut you double your distance the tree will move.
So if I have a tree 12" diameter and one 6" diameter and cut 12" off the 12" and 6" off the 6" tree: The bottoms of the blocks represent the back of the tree to the undercut. 6" back cut & hinge vs 12" back & hinge.
If you put a 1" wedges under both blocks then they both reach the same offset of 1"
but the 12" block takes double the height to reach an equal offset...and so on...
If you want a guide then eyeball up your tree the same distance of wtf ever the back of tree to desired undercut may be
then plump down using a tape or stick or wedge for a straight edge. The gap to the tree is the gap you have to overcome with your wedges.( *Minis saw kerf from wedges)
It's another trick that can help dial people in closer for a better perspective. Many things to consider.

So if that was a 32" tree.
50℅ vs 25℅ undercut
24" 'back cut' vs 16"
Difference of 1/3
So a wedge will move a tree with a 50 % undercut 33% further than a tree with a 25% undercut but it doesn't mean the wedge will penetrate half as far per hit?
It's just gears man, but you only get to pick one when you drive up the hill?
How much weight are we pulling?
I like my low gears

Not sure what kind of wedges these were,i have some red heads somewhere i will have to find them ,they were easy to find that day so i used them ,here is some more pics ,i normally don"t photo tree falling ,but this one was a big one for me ,i turned it into a garage .

 

[bitzer]

As long as all the muffler bolts are tight that shouldn't be happening with an oem muffler. Those bolts like to loosen tho. Even the Chinese mufflers have been ok with tight bolts.

Are the starters pre-strung with cord or is that happening after? Too thick a cord will grab and the teeth will get chewed on the pawls.

 

[Coltont]

As long as all the muffler bolts are tight that shouldn't be happening with an oem muffler. Those bolts like to loosen tho. Even the Chinese mufflers have been ok with tight bolts.

Are the starters pre-strung with cord or is that happening after? Too thick a cord will grab and the teeth will get chewed on the pawls.

The bolts are all tight. I'll have to see if I have any of the junk mufflers around and get a picture. The starter is coming as just the plastic gear. The plastic pieces that catch the flywheel , I think there's 4 of them. Those are what's breaking off on it. Switched to 390s cause the 661s aren't dependable enough. The 390 will always run great and start rite up, just never know what's gonna break or rattle out.

 

[Skeans1]

The bolts are all tight. I'll have to see if I have any of the junk mufflers around and get a picture. The starter is coming as just the plastic gear. The plastic pieces that catch the flywheel , I think there's 4 of them. Those are what's breaking off on it. Switched to 390s cause the 661s aren't dependable enough. The 390 will always run great and start rite up, just never know what's gonna break or rattle out.

On the starter are you missing a bushing that attaches to the recoil housing?


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[Coltont]

On the starter are you missing a bushing that attaches to the recoil housing?


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If it's missing I never noticed it. It fits exactly as it should.

 

[bitzer]

The plastic gear is getting hung up somehow. I've got a gear or two that was shaved off by the pawls and it either got caught on too thick of pull cord(from the dealer) or the knot that holds the cord in sticks out too far and grabs for a second letting the pawls tear the plastic up.

I've had mufflers rattle apart like you're talking but it's usually when ive lost a bolt on the outside mounting bolts. Do you have the gasket and heat shield behind the muffler? I've had some come with thicker gaskets. Maybe the bolts are just barely bottoming out on the cylinder side. Enough that it seems tight but not?

 

[Coltont]

The plastic gear is getting hung up somehow. I've got a gear or two that was shaved off by the pawls and it either got caught on too thick of pull cord(from the dealer) or the knot that holds the cord in sticks out too far and grabs for a second letting the pawls tear the plastic up.

I've had mufflers rattle apart like you're talking but it's usually when ive lost a bolt on the outside mounting bolts. Do you have the gasket and heat shield behind the muffler? I've had some come with thicker gaskets. Maybe the bolts are just barely bottoming out on the cylinder side. Enough that it seems tight but not?

Yea have the heat shield and gasket in place. 2 gallons a day is about average out of it. I'll have to check out the knot like your saying .

 

[Skeans1]

Yea have the heat shield and gasket in place. 2 gallons a day is about average out of it. I'll have to check out the knot like your saying .

Thinking back I have had one crack like you’re talking about where I tightened the mount before tightening the muffler to the flange maybe that’s the issue. Or maybe it was the other way around I can’t remember right off hand something isn’t lining up at the very least.


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[Coltont]

Thinking back I have had one crack like you’re talking about where I tightened the mount before tightening the muffler to the flange maybe that’s the issue. Or maybe it was the other way around I can’t remember right off hand something isn’t lining up at the very least.


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I think the 2 piece design like stihl uses on the 066/660 etc is a much better design.

 

[huskihl]

I think the 2 piece design like stihl uses on the 066/660 etc is a much better design.

Wonder if a guy could braze the outside of the muffler to the tubes when it was new if it would last any longer.

 

[Coltont]

Wonder if a guy could braze the outside of the muffler to the tubes when it was new if it would last any longer.

That's exactly what it needs.

 

[bitzer]

Colton here's an oem muffler that ran minus two bolts for a few hours. I knew one had shaken out and then another but I had just a few hours cutting on the job and no more bolts. Finished the job with no muffler and a fat carb.



Here's a Chinese muffler ran with a missing bolt for a few days.



The current mufflers. Oem on left

 

[huskihl]

Colton here's an oem muffler that ran minus two bolts for a few hours. I knew one had shaken out and then another but I had just a few hours cutting on the job and no more bolts. Finished the job with no muffler and a fat carb.

View attachment 181504

Here's a Chinese muffler ran with a missing bolt for a few days.

View attachment 181505

The current mufflers. Oem on left

View attachment 181506

That top one looks like a @mdavlee race muffler

 

[bitzer]

That top one looks like a @mdavlee race muffler

Yeah she was a loud one