STIHL Progressive Depth Gauge Tools

[Philbert]

This is what my gauges get looking like in short order.

!!!

. . . they should last a lot longer.View attachment 215489

Agreed!

Philbert

 

[ferris]

You guys make an obsession out of everything.

I reset the rakers on a new loop depending what saw it will be paired up with, then don't touch them for numerous sharpenings.
I again reset the rakers when I notice the chain racing, not taking a bite.

I eyeball raker height, no gauges.

I have to worry about a boatload of stuff every day, rakers are not something I will loose any thought over.

In the past i did the same, but most of the time the rakers get to deep

 

[Wonkydonkey]

I tested the brandynew chain today. I gave each tooth 2 licks with the file and you saw above what I did the the rakers.
The wood was London plane, and the saw was the 044 that I rebuilt

 

[Wilhelm]

In the past i did the same, but most of the time the rakers get to deep

You just need a more powerful saw or a shorter bar.

I have gone as deep as .05-.06 on an Oregon chisel loop for my stock Dolmar PS-7900, 20" 3/8" B&C setup - she pulled the loop fiercely in hardwoods.
Chain never snapped and made it to becoming a stump chain.

 

[Wonkydonkey]

You just need a more powerful saw or a shorter bar.

I have gone as deep as .05-.06 on an Oregon chisel loop for my stock Dolmar PS-7900, 20" 3/8" B&C setup - she pulled the loop fiercely in hardwoods.
Chain never snapped and made it to becoming a stump chain.

I got an 18” Oregon 75.. set at just below softwood setting, it ripped up hard woods,

This chain I want to be nice to it,, use the file plates and see how it goes,,, I’ve got chains that have hit nails etc..when you have less than half the tooth left, I don’t mind playing/experimenting a bit

 

[ferris]

You just need a more powerful saw or a shorter bar.

I have gone as deep as .05-.06 on an Oregon chisel loop for my stock Dolmar PS-7900, 20" 3/8" B&C setup - she pulled the loop fiercely in hardwoods.
Chain never snapped and made it to becoming a stump chain.

That is not the problem
I normally use short bars
60cc—>18“
70cc —>20“

When you make bore cuts, the problem with the rakers begins

 

[ferris]

I tested the brandynew chain today. I gave each tooth 2 licks with the file and you saw above what I did the the rakers.
The wood was London plane, and the saw was the 044 that I rebuilt

A little bit to fat

 

[Wilhelm]

That is not the problem
I normally use short bars
60cc—>18“
70cc —>20“

When you make bore cuts, the problem with the rakers begins

Limbing with a chain featuring low rakers can also become very unpleasant, don't ask me how I know.

 

[Wonkydonkey]

A little bit to fat

Yes I was just saying about that in my other thread, I’m going to fit a new carb with the HD air filter
Edit to add the link
http://opeforum.com/threads/whats-saw-is-in-the-package-an-ooerr44-arctic.18349/page-10#post-985141

 

[SteveSr]

When you make bore cuts, the problem with the rakers begins

Can you elaborate? How should the rakers be set for good boring performance?

I have noticed that a new chain out of the box will bore cut pretty well. However, after several sharpenings the chain will start to get "rough, grabby, jumpy" while doing the boring and have been trying to figure out why. This seems to be considerably more noticeable/problematic on hard wood like oak rather than soft wood like pine.

BTW, the chain is properly sharpened either by hand using the Stihl file guide or an Oregon dremel type sharpener usually using diamond stones. The rakers were set using the Stihl flat gauge that comes in the wrap-up kit.

 

[Wonkydonkey]

Not only are those not ergonomic, but I think they should stamp "soft" all over the whole things, because the metal is very soft on them considering what they are designed to do.

Philbert I know you remove them and then put them back on to test for clearance, it's fine for some instances, but I'd rather not do it that way. And it's also not how its shown in the instructions, so they should hold up better.

The style Philbert posted above is what I prefer over the ones on the roller guide, I also like the way these stihl guides work so far, used the 325 today again and went a bit lower than the hard setting(could use a little lower on this particular chain though, it has the ramps on it)

This is what my gauges get looking like in short order. I only use them to file in the field, or on one tooth per side on each chain and then grind the rest, they should last a lot longer.
View attachment 215489

I just watched bucking, skip to 32:10 lamao..... I know he’s loving the Carlton file plates, and sayin yuk to husky
Edit to add link

 

[ferris]

Can you elaborate? How should the rakers be set for good boring performance?

I have noticed that a new chain out of the box will bore cut pretty well. However, after several sharpenings the chain will start to get "rough, grabby, jumpy" while doing the boring and have been trying to figure out why. This seems to be considerably more noticeable/problematic on hard wood like oak rather than soft wood like pine.

BTW, the chain is properly sharpened either by hand using the Stihl file guide or an Oregon dremel type sharpener usually using diamond stones. The rakers were set using the Stihl flat gauge that comes in the wrap-up kit.

Pls check @Wonkydonkey answer #131
He checked a new chain and filed the rakers after using the gauge.
A new Stihl chain in example has high rakers, with high rakers u can bore cut.
If u said them low u can’t.

 

[Wonkydonkey]

Yes @ferris, an @SteveSr
The link to the post above,,, http://opeforum.com/threads/stihl-progressive-depth-gauge-tools.18288/page-7#post-984533

It was a new chain out of the box, sometimes the rakers are a little high. I was just highlighting this, I could bore cut easily. But if you set the rakers to low ie, for soft wood and you try to bore cut hardwood it would be jumpy/kick back
This is not the only answer/reason as to why it’s jumpy/rough and wanting to kick back..
Type of chain, how you file it.

My answer is to be careful if your new, and seek more local help.. there is asking questions on the Internet when we only see what you write. You can get many answers, but what’s right or wrong ?
Posting pics or vids helps a lot. I know threads get derailed, but maybe you need to start a thread..and ask, some one may give you a link to a thread or read some of the chain threads..
Bucking has some good vids on filing,

I hope this helps.
Edit: maybe compare a new chain to your filed chain... is you depth gauge from the stihl file package for soft or hard wood ie 25 or 30thou or whatever the dif is.. have you checked the depth gauge with a new chain, does you teeth have to much hook after you have filed it...do you file on the gauge has it got thinner.. you could even be using the wrong file (round file). How are the chips like when you cross cut..
honestly there are so many things I can ask... if you show pics that’s a lot more simple

The edited bit is a bit rambled so it jumps around a bit so you will have to read and understand it,

 

[SteveSr]

Yes @ferris, an @SteveSr
The link to the post above,,, http://opeforum.com/threads/stihl-progressive-depth-gauge-tools.18288/page-7#post-984533

It was a new chain out of the box, sometimes the rakers are a little high. I was just highlighting this, I could bore cut easily. But if you set the rakers to low ie, for soft wood and you try to bore cut hardwood it would be jumpy/kick back
This is not the only answer/reason as to why it’s jumpy/rough and wanting to kick back..
Type of chain, how you file it.

My answer is to be careful if your new, and seek more local help.. there is asking questions on the Internet when we only see what you write. You can get many answers, but what’s right or wrong ?
Posting pics or vids helps a lot. I know threads get derailed, but maybe you need to start a thread..and ask, some one may give you a link to a thread or read some of the chain threads..
Bucking has some good vids on filing,

I hope this helps.
Edit: maybe compare a new chain to your filed chain... is you depth gauge from the stihl file package for soft or hard wood ie 25 or 30thou or whatever the dif is.. have you checked the depth gauge with a new chain, does you teeth have to much hook after you have filed it...do you file on the gauge has it got thinner.. you could even be using the wrong file (round file). How are the chips like when you cross cut..
honestly there are so many things I can ask... if you show pics that’s a lot more simple

The edited bit is a bit rambled so it jumps around a bit so you will have to read and understand it,

Sorry to hijack a thread! So it sounds like I need to watch my raker filing which is likely to be made worse (for bore cutting anyway) by using these progressive raker gauges.

I am also curious on the effect of the distance between the cutting edge and the raker as it goes around the tip of the bar. It seems like this might make it more aggressive as well and may account for some of what I am seeing with the bucking and kicking on a chain that has been sharpened before.

 

[~WBF]

Can you elaborate? How should the rakers be set for good boring performance?

I have noticed that a new chain out of the box will bore cut pretty well. However, after several sharpenings the chain will start to get "rough, grabby, jumpy" while doing the boring and have been trying to figure out why. This seems to be considerably more noticeable/problematic on hard wood like oak rather than soft wood like pine.

BTW, the chain is properly sharpened either by hand using the Stihl file guide or an Oregon dremel type sharpener usually using diamond stones. The rakers were set using the Stihl flat gauge that comes in the wrap-up kit.

Sounds more to do with cutter profile/s and possibly a bit to do with raker profile rather than it being too deep of a cut. A least for that particular AV system and tip circumference and bar weight. It all plays a part. Basically if it works fine stock then at .025" then we know that it is not the problem. I run into this more with smaller saws more than bigger saws also lite bars with round chisel can't absorb the same as heavy bars w RC
I am running into this with the Boss's ms261. It has some history of getting hit as I understand and certainly could at least use the one mount but that saw just won't be as rigid as the likes of the 560 husky when new.
Anyway it has a very small dog on it so I still file pretty aggressive as for it to work for the majority of cutting and most hardwoods in the bore. I'm at .030 on the husky gauge on .325 stihl chain.
On sweet chestnut it is perfect for the bore cut. I think I went to the bigger13/64 file. You can file up into the corner instead of staying under the leading edge. It's BS that it has to be a point. It will change the dynamics though
That will calm it down. You should end up with a longer shaving. This works in conjunction with the dogs well then saw is underpowered vs high teeth count in the cut..OR it wants to clutch out on contact as say with certain species (angle felling cut with the dog in) It's the 9" tree that will stop a 390xp dead with the big spikes and not the larger trees.
Your chain may come factory 10° up and your gauge may not? Semi chisel may be a better option on a 'loose' saw.

What is everyone's opinion on the chain Kerf narrowing as the chain is filed back?

 

[chipper1]

What is everyone's opinion on the chain Kerf narrowing as the chain is filed back?

That it does.

 

[chipper1]

I just watched bucking, skip to 32:10 lamao..... I know he’s loving the Carlton file plates, and sayin yuk to husky
Edit to add link

Saw it right before I posted, notice it didn't stop me from posting .
I liked the part where he was talking about the "C" and it was a square chain in his hand, but it was just like the chain he was sharpening . I do watch his videos, but unfortunately the only comments allowed without getting "bucked" by the buckster and his army are positive ones.

Sorry to hijack a thread! So it sounds like I need to watch my raker filing which is likely to be made worse (for bore cutting anyway) by using these progressive raker gauges.

I am also curious on the effect of the distance between the cutting edge and the raker as it goes around the tip of the bar. It seems like this might make it more aggressive as well and may account for some of what I am seeing with the bucking and kicking on a chain that has been sharpened before.

A progressive gauge is one of many ways to set rakers, it is my preferred method as it's quick compared to setting based on the angle(you may need to do more reading to learn that), and it sets them better for the cutting I do than a standard .025-.030 raker gauge.
What type of chain are you currently running, what saw, and what bar, these can all have an effect on kickback in general and especially when boring.
Here's a video of a stock ms291 with a full chisel safety chain that has had the safety ramps removed boring, I should have done a before video, it wouldn't bore at all(which I found boring lol).
Sorry about the ppe, it was a joke with a few members .

 

[chipper1]

Chain never snapped and made it to becoming a stump chain.

Just told a friend yesterday to stop cutting with a chain that had been poorly "sharpened" yesterday. Too small of a file so it had huge hook , the chain was about half life and the rakers had hardly been touched. I set him up with another bar and chain and told him I'd get it cutting right for him, I got one side done and flipped the clamp on the grinder(I wasn't filing it all back how it should have been by hand ), when I got started I saw a broken link. Not sure exactly what happened, but I'd blame it on the sharpening and improper use, a properly tuned chain makes cutting a pleasure and is much safer.

 

[SteveSr]

A progressive gauge is one of many ways to set rakers, it is my preferred method as it's quick compared to setting based on the angle(you may need to do more reading to learn that), and it sets them better for the cutting I do than a standard .025-.030 raker gauge.
What type of chain are you currently running, what saw, and what bar, these can all have an effect on kickback in general and especially when boring.

The saw is a Stihl MS260 with a 16" .325/.063 setup. The chain is either Oregon 22BPX or Stihl RMC semi-chisel.

 

[chipper1]

The saw is a Stihl MS260 with a 16" .325/.063 setup. The chain is either Oregon 22BPX or Stihl RMC semi-chisel.

Did you see the bore cut in the video, your saw should be perfectly fine for boring and it should be just as capable as that 291.
The Oregon 22bpx is a safety chain and will not bore, if I' correct on the letters the stihl chain should be a non safety chain and would bore better, but I prefer full chisel for boring.
Hope this helps.