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Has Anyone Here Ever Bought A Saw From Kenny?

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Mastermind

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Look into PCD (polycrystaline diamond) tooling.

For example: https://www.mcmaster.com/diamond-tipped-lathe-bits/

They're not cheap so don't waste them on jobs when they're not needed, but treated gently they'll last a very long time. It's a good weapon to have in your arsenal. Cut like a dream in any aluminum alloy - might find yourself thinking the surface is a little TOO good.
I found a careful hand-sharpening of brazed carbide on DMT stones was much more manageable than HSS with a longer tool life. Low-grade inserts out of the box wouldn't cut right, for sure, and were worse than HSS.

I use carbide on squish bands. Many cylinders have plating across the band and into the combustion chamber, so HSS isn't gonna last too long cutting that. But for my base cut I like the HSS. Easy to sharpen to get a nice finish.
 

Nutball

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@Moparmyway that setup was for leveling transfers, not cutting base or band (photo below.) Yes, the axis of the cylinder is the primary datum and the only thing that matters. Since I had already trued the base, then grinding the fins dead parallel to the base meant I could just stick the thing upsidedown and guarantee that all of the transfers would be timed identically with respect to the base. I swept the bore up and down with an indicator in the spindle and it was true. Could have indicated it in that way, sure, but the setup would not have been as rigid. Didn't want to risk the setup moving which could cause the plating to chip or loss of accuracy. Without a surface grinder there's other ways to do it, for sure, just more work and less certainty.
And yes, as others have said "tenth" is shorthand for 0.0001" or 2.5microns. Sorry, didn't realize that wasn't common parlance.
View attachment 309282

@Mastermind There is clearance in the 4 corner mounting holes of the band cutting fixture, and the posts are moveable on the faceplate. I can tap around that whole plate to adjust concentricity independently of perpendicularity, just like a four-jaw but with less hassle. Such a thing could be done in a 4-jaw instead of a faceplate, it would just take a couple of extra minutes. By design, since it locates on the spindle nose and the cylinder mounting holes it's at most 0.005-0.010" runout if you just slap it together. I thought about making a mandrel that would center on the plate, but I think that'd only get to about 0.001-0.002" with the bore tolerance and clearance figured in and it isn't much work to just indicate the thing.
As it is, since the base has already been cut true to the cylinder this guarantees that there is no wobble, only concentric runout. That means sweeping any location along the bore will true the axis of the cylinder to the axis of the lathe. If there was runout at the top different than the bottom, it would mean that the base is off and needs to be trued. Of course, you always cut or true the base first. If you didn't care about perpendicularity of the base, then it could be shimmed true.
Of course, none of this works if the fixture isn't flat and perpendicular to the axis. The plate is ground flat and parallel to better than 0.0005" over ~4" so as long as the posts are all the same height off of the faceplate, then the plane of fixture plate/base is guaranteed perpendicular to the axis of the lathe. To get the posts the same height, I just skim cut them when I install the faceplate. They're stiff enough that a light cut (only takes a thou or so) trues it up and at that point the error is no greater than the runout of the spindle bearings, which is negligible (just barely 0.0001") when measured at the opening of the fixture plate.

Honestly, with the all-thread setup you'd probably make it easier on yourself by using a ground or accurately turned bar in the cylinder to externalize the reference than running a long reach indicator up there. At least on a used cylinder that would average out the errors in the bore since they don't stay round forever. Same result, but don't take my word for it.
As you said, you've got a system that works and if it works there's no need to change it.




By the way, no need for y'all to be so sensitive! I didn't expect that from the pitchfork mob I was seeing that was my only introduction to the group.

Didn't expect "hack" to be viewed as such a pejorative in context.
Plenty of 3-chord guitar players sitting in million dollar mansions after all.
Maybe I spend too much time talking to machinists where there's lots of pride/arrogance about going for perfection. Need to code-switch over here, I suppose. I don't doubt y'all can turn out good work on a relatively crude fixture with extra care and experience, but I've seen images elsewhere that seem to defy physics. I don't understand how a person can tighten all-thread enough to get sufficient torsional stiffness to prevent chatter and movement while also doing precise adjustment, and I would expect any chatter would mean that cylinder is in a different location at the end of the cut than it was at the beginning.
I admit my experience is limited, but almost all of the cylinders that I have held in my hands that had been cut by others showed measurable perpendicularity errors cylinder to base and concentricity errors at the band. I have no idea of their provenance so I'm not trying to attack anyone. Maybe it doesn't matter, it's just a saw. I did what I did to save setup time and avoid chatter, precision is a bonus.
So, I could stick a rod in the cylinder to help align it for cutting the squish band? Seems like a good idea, I might experiment with that.
Look into PCD (polycrystaline diamond) tooling.

For example: https://www.mcmaster.com/diamond-tipped-lathe-bits/

They're not cheap so don't waste them on jobs when they're not needed, but treated gently they'll last a very long time. It's a good weapon to have in your arsenal. Cut like a dream in any aluminum alloy - might find yourself thinking the surface is a little TOO good.
I found a careful hand-sharpening of brazed carbide on DMT stones was much more manageable than HSS with a longer tool life. Low-grade inserts out of the box wouldn't cut right, for sure, and were worse than HSS.
Any tips on how to sharpen HSS and carbide, what angles and such, and what exactly makes the low grade inserts not cut well, so we can avoid that issue?
 

AshlandMachinist

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So, I could stick a rod in the cylinder to help align it for cutting the squish band? Seems like a good idea, I might experiment with that.

Any tips on how to sharpen HSS and carbide, what angles and such, and what exactly makes the low grade inserts not cut well, so we can avoid that issue?


Regarding the rod, if it's a good fit, then absolutely. Machinists do this with gauge pins for setups all of the time. Sometimes sweeping a bore is difficult, or as with a cylinder, the interruptions make it difficult to get a good "average" of the overall geometry when it isn't perfectly round. Your accuracy will be limited by the tolerance of the fit, and you might end up with lots of very similar "pins" to cover size variation. If the fit isn't great, then even as a roughing-in step I would argue it would save some hassle, though. Could also do an "expanding mandrel" that is slitted over half the length with a cone that draws in from a through-bolt to expand it, which will still maintain concentricity very well for displacements <0.010" of so - the reverse of a collet.


I don't have any secrets for HSS beyond standard turning geometries. Maybe Mastermind has some tricks up his sleeve, but for shallow cuts the geometry is forgiving as long as it's sharp.

For carbide, I've been using brazed carbide (flat on top) with zero rake and a 7 degree relief. For skirted cylinders I use a 60 degree tool that I've whetted a ~0.010" radius on to get a tight corner. The small radius means I can cut 0.01" DOC without presenting an undercut and seems to be a sharp enough corner radius yet don't need to worry about running into the wall. A couple licks with a fine DMT stone as needed after working the top surface.
The carbide inserts I use are the "premium" micrograin for semi-interrupted cuts. The economy no-name inserts are generally pretty dull and that's why lots of folks prefer HSS. On a big CNC a "dull" cutter (relatively speaking )is an advantage as the machine is stiff enough to supply the force needed to cut, but the dull edge has more cutting life since carbide is brittle. For small machines, the sharper the tool the less cutting force, less chatter, better finish, but low grade carbide won't last long taken to a razor edge on an interrupted cut as with a base. It might not be obvious by eye, but it'll show in the surface finish that the edge is fractured. The chip-breaker presents a positive rake if sharpened to a point which is not good if you have backlash, but not a problem with weight and stiffness. It's also more fragile and you just don't need a chipbreaker for cast, period.
When in doubt, check with a microscope.
 

AshlandMachinist

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I use carbide on squish bands. Many cylinders have plating across the band and into the combustion chamber, so HSS isn't gonna last too long cutting that. But for my base cut I like the HSS. Easy to sharpen to get a nice finish.

Sure, but I just meant PCD for the 5 series Husqvarna alloy. I'm not using PCD presently as it hasn't been necessary, but if I was having surface finish difficulty I would in a heartbeat. I haven't been called upon to cut a 5 series.
I use them at work all the time and can turn a literal mirror finish on the Hardinge when necessary.
 

tickbitintn

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Yeah turtles are better they are quiet and less scary.
Unless it's one of those snappers [emoji217]

Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk
 

Nutball

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Regarding the rod, if it's a good fit, then absolutely. Machinists do this with gauge pins for setups all of the time. Sometimes sweeping a bore is difficult, or as with a cylinder, the interruptions make it difficult to get a good "average" of the overall geometry when it isn't perfectly round. Your accuracy will be limited by the tolerance of the fit, and you might end up with lots of very similar "pins" to cover size variation. If the fit isn't great, then even as a roughing-in step I would argue it would save some hassle, though. Could also do an "expanding mandrel" that is slitted over half the length with a cone that draws in from a through-bolt to expand it, which will still maintain concentricity very well for displacements <0.010" of so - the reverse of a collet.


I don't have any secrets for HSS beyond standard turning geometries. Maybe Mastermind has some tricks up his sleeve, but for shallow cuts the geometry is forgiving as long as it's sharp.

For carbide, I've been using brazed carbide (flat on top) with zero rake and a 7 degree relief. For skirted cylinders I use a 60 degree tool that I've whetted a ~0.010" radius on to get a tight corner. The small radius means I can cut 0.01" DOC without presenting an undercut and seems to be a sharp enough corner radius yet don't need to worry about running into the wall. A couple licks with a fine DMT stone as needed after working the top surface.
The carbide inserts I use are the "premium" micrograin for semi-interrupted cuts. The economy no-name inserts are generally pretty dull and that's why lots of folks prefer HSS. On a big CNC a "dull" cutter (relatively speaking )is an advantage as the machine is stiff enough to supply the force needed to cut, but the dull edge has more cutting life since carbide is brittle. For small machines, the sharper the tool the less cutting force, less chatter, better finish, but low grade carbide won't last long taken to a razor edge on an interrupted cut as with a base. It might not be obvious by eye, but it'll show in the surface finish that the edge is fractured. The chip-breaker presents a positive rake if sharpened to a point which is not good if you have backlash, but not a problem with weight and stiffness. It's also more fragile and you just don't need a chipbreaker for cast, period.
When in doubt, check with a microscope.
I use Nylon rods. I can take a razor blade to make some shallow cuts that produce a slightly raised surface on each side when the razor blade plowed it's groove. A few of those make the rod a tight fit. It may offer enough precision for a hack like me to get by. So far I use that method for cutting bases instead of using a steel or aluminum mandrel.
 

Mastermind

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@AshlandMachinist

You seem like a pretty sane fella. So, you live next door to Kenny.....and do some machine work for him. But how well do you really know your neighbor?

Keep in mind how we got here. I got reports from several members that Kenny was approaching them in private nearly demanding that he be hired to port a saw for them. They all felt that he was wired wrong and wanted nothing more than for him to leave them alone. Getting him to stop pushing them into allowing him to work on their saws wasn't a simple task.

At first I didn't realize just how pushy he was being, so I ignored these reports for awhile because it seemed fairly harmless, as no one was even considering allowing him to touch their saw.

Then, he mentioned that he had a couple of saws to sell, and that he would port these saws for 300.00 extra. I read that post I decided it was time to speak up.

Having never seen a single example of his work either on a forum, or in person, and with these reports in hand, I asked to see the tools that he was planned to use to port these saws. He blew up, and told me to F**K OFF. A few hours later after he realized that there was no way I would let this go, he posted a picture of a Foredom motor, and few cords, and a closed toolbox.

About this same time, I found out that he had volunteered to port a saw for a raffle we had done some years before....and that the saw was never returned. Now you have heard him say that he tried for years to reach this fella so he could send this saw back. That's really strange, because at about the same time he stopped posting on the site that he agreed to do the saw on. Then he changed his username from Naked Arborist to Lightning Performance and moved to this forum. Over all these years, he has never once mentioned to a soul here, or there that he had this saw.....or that he was attempting to find the owner. Never. Not one time.

One of our members found the old thread where Kenny volunteered.....and got the owner's username. I messaged him on ArboristSite, and on this forum. Within the day I had made contact with the man. So....what kept Kenny from finding this man is a mystery. He was right here.

He still had the text messages and all the forum messages from communicating with Kenny. They had some talk back and forth.....and before too long Kenny stopped replying. Then Todd sent Kenny a letter. He shared with me the address that he sent the letter too. He was smart enough to preserve everything. But at this point the last thing he wants is to get dragged into the middle of a confrontation with a guy that rants and raves like a manic. We got Todd a nice saw like the one Kenny took.....along with a bar, and some chains. Todd finally got the ported saw he waited on for 8 years.....no thanks to your neighbor.

Now Kenny has shown up over on ArboristSite with his Lightning Performance moniker, and is raving about how unfairly he was treated, and threatening to kill or main a few of us. I'll drop a link to his ravings for your reading pleasure.

https://www.arboristsite.com/threads/has-anyone-seen.267893/page-3#post-7577580
 

jakethesnake

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@Moparmyway Send ken that addy. Maybe he does have the saw. Maybe he will send it back.

I have no idea if he has the mans saw still. I know I’ve procrastinated in the past. Maybe not 8 years. Nor pretended something wasn’t my fault if it truly was.

no harm in trying though.

and no. I’m not taking any sides in this. Just reading along. Kenny was wrong. Sure. But if dart gets his *s-word back. At least that’s worth something. Certainly doesn’t clear his name. But it’s worth something
 

Moparmyway

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@71dart
@Mastermind

I've PM'd 71dart for his address, hoping to have Kenny ship the saw to him (or to me if he doesnt want Kenny to have his address, and I'll ship the saw to 71dart, and keep his address confidential)

Why ?
71 dart has a saw, right ? The one we replaced the stolen saw with !

Kenny still NEEDS to make this right and send the saw back !!
 

Mastermind

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@71dart
@Mastermind

I've PM'd 71dart for his address, hoping to have Kenny ship the saw to him (or to me if he doesnt want Kenny to have his address, and I'll ship the saw to 71dart, and keep his address confidential)

Why ?
71 dart has a saw, right ? The one we replaced the stolen saw with !

Kenny still NEEDS to make this right and send the saw back !!

I'd be surprised if Todd replies to you. I'd imagine he wants nothing more to do with this.
 

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Maybe whoever was kind enough to donate the 'make up' saw to Todd should now get the original saw from Kenny, should it miraculously materialize that is.

I find it absolutely impossible to actually believe that Kenny still has this saw. If by some miracle he does have it, I doubt it has been sitting there all these years without being used. It's far more likely that it has been used up over these last 8 years.
 

USMC615

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I read Skinny’s last post/reply to wcorey last night…Deflection 101, running his cock holster about everything except the main thing…sending the man his god damn saw back, and never mentioned a single word about returning the saw…nothing.

@AshlandMachinist …hate to inform you, but you got a real POS shacking up next door to ya!
 

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I read Skinny’s last post/reply to wcorey last night…Deflection 101, running his cock holster about everything except the main thing…sending the man his god damn saw back, and never mentioned a single word about returning the saw…nothing.

@AshlandMachinist …hate to inform you, but you got a real POS shacking up next door to ya!
Another man not censored, never afraid to speak his mind.
I’d like to drink a beer (or 13) with you someday.

Who’s going to Tennessee next month?
 
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