Gutting the hinge discussion

[Catbuster]

I actually did take a swipe at the heart on this one. Thick side = tension.

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I don’t see where you did-maybe I’m seeing things differently. If you did though, you didn’t take enough.

That’s a lot of wedges. Do think gutting the fiber pull area would have helped?

Yes. That is exactly why production cutters in hardwoods gut that area. It makes the tree easier to wedge, and it prevents fiber pull.

 

[davidwyby]

That’s a lot of wedges. Do think gutting the fiber pull area would have helped?

Probably. Limb tied back leaner too.

 

[davidwyby]

I don’t see where you did-maybe I’m seeing things differently. If you did though, you didn’t take enough.



Yes. That is exactly why production cutters in hardwoods gut that area. It makes the tree easier to wedge, and it prevents fiber pull.

The little divot into the back side of the hinge, I stuck the nose in the back of the hinge when I took the bar out.

 

[Catbuster]

The little divot into the back side of the hinge, I stuck the nose in the back of the hinge when I took the bar out.

I follow. When I’m thinking about gutting the hinge I’m more in the leaving somewhere between 10-25% as posts on the outside and really cutting all of what’s in the middle.

 

[davidwyby]

I follow. When I’m thinking about gutting the hinge I’m more in the leaving somewhere between 10-25% as posts on the outside and really cutting all of what’s in the middle.

Yeah...I think I'm about done with gap faces and tall thin hinges. Only question left is two fat posts or one thin hinge. @afleetcommand doesn't want to pull fiber, so he designs his cuts so that the tree crushes the hinge. I'm not worried about pulling fiber, these short grained trees don't pull much anyway. I want control, so my face and hinge need to be able to support the tree. I think that's why the bigger trees I winched over with thicker hinges actually hinged - but wedging those would have been nigh on impossible.

 

[Hoser]

Does that % of heart bored out matter depending on tree diameter/ how dead it is?
I tried it on a couple ash and elm last year but always left 30-50%, mainly just wanted to reduce the risk of the ash chairing, limb weight and lean were favourable to direction it needed to go.

 

[Catbuster]

Does that % of heart bored out matter depending on tree diameter/ how dead it is?
I tried it on a couple ash and elm last year but always left 30-50%, mainly just wanted to reduce the risk of the ash chairing, limb weight and lean were favourable to direction it needed to go.

If I want more directional control I’ll leave the posts fatter. Sometimes front to back is just as helpful as side-to-side width.

If I’m worried about barberchair I’ll leave the posts smaller so there’s less wood to pull. Dead Ash trees are brutal.

I may be completely backwards with this line of thinking though.

It sounds like a cop out, but it’s not an exact science, especially with hardwood trees, and especially ones with big tops.

 

[davidwyby]

It’s is said that on green trees at least, the sap (outer) wood is more flexible and may hold better…center/heart wood less flexible and less hold, more resistant to wedging.

 

[Woodpecker]

If I want more directional control I’ll leave the posts fatter. Sometimes front to back is just as helpful as side-to-side width.

If I’m worried about barberchair I’ll leave the posts smaller so there’s less wood to pull. Dead Ash trees are brutal.

I may be completely backwards with this line of thinking though.

It sounds like a cop out, but it’s not an exact science, especially with hardwood trees, and especially ones with big tops.

I don’t think that’s a cop out at all. Everything is subjective and based upon what result needs to be achieved as far as hinge wood is concerned. For example, good luck getting a dead white ash to hinge at all or a white pine for that matter.

The rule of thumb I was taught as a young cull is that the hinge should be 80% the length of the DBH of the tree and 10% the width. So a 25” DBH tree “should” have a 20” length x 2.5” wide hinge. So if I followed that rule I’d gut only 5” of the heartwood. However, the sheer amount of variables involved practically render that rule moot. It’s really just a basic starting point. Experience has taught me there is a whole lotta CYA and oh shít baked into that rule.

At this point I rely on feel and species dependent knowledge when setting up the hinge. Having said all that my goals are going to vary greatly from someone who isn’t working everyday in small suburban/city residential lots.

 

[Hoser]

I did play a little with steering the tree by gutting out the centre of the hinge unevenly instead steering it with my back cut.
I mostly cut dead ash so I just try to do what I can to not smash up the crown of healthy trees but also hang around the stump as little as possible.
If any of that makes sense.
Excellent discussion/ pointers, thank you

 

[Mastermind]

Great discussion men.