Going through a 346 OE at work..

[RIDE-RED 350r]

Well after a little more extensive searching, I have found a couple of online vendors that have parts diagrams for the HDA159a-1. I don't recall if the carb I am working with is a -1 or not... But the -1 does have and accelerator pump..

Here's the bad news: pump piston service kit stated to be NLA... So, if in fact this is my problem, it's not even serviceable due to lack of parts availability...

Might still try the Napa carb soak solution as a last ditch effort, just to make sure..

And I just have to say, the saw runs terrific with the Zama from my NE on it!! So my overhaul seems to have been successful once I get a carb on it that will feed it proper some way or another.

 

[beaglebriar]

I'd replace it and be done.

 

[Simondo]

Well after a little more extensive searching, I have found a couple of online vendors that have parts diagrams for the HDA159a-1. I don't recall if the carb I am working with is a -1 or not... But the -1 does have and accelerator pump..

Here's the bad news: pump piston service kit stated to be NLA... So, if in fact this is my problem, it's not even serviceable due to lack of parts availability...

Might still try the Napa carb soak solution as a last ditch effort, just to make sure..

And I just have to say, the saw runs terrific with the Zama from my NE on it!! So my overhaul seems to have been successful once I get a carb on it that will feed it proper some way or another.

A brass plug about 1/4 round flush with the body and on the line of the butterfly spindle is the give away. You have found the same with regards to a service kit as i did. The brass plunger can get scored up in the carb body and stick or just not do its job accurately..Im also for getting a carb replacement as you have proved your 159 is "Troublesome" ...Took my carb pump out as a exercise to see how and what was up…fiddly job plus having Walbro service tools would be better. Swap her out

 

[RIDE-RED 350r]

I really appreciate the advice fellas! I never knew these things had an accelerator pump and I would have been driving myself insane trying to figure out what the issue is. When I disassembled the carb to do the kit, I found it to be only slightly dirty inside, nothing that would lead me to believe the carb is not salvageable.

I'm still being a bum sitting in my lazy-boy right now. But I will go out and confirm whether or not it has the pump. I recently picked up an HDA175 for my 359 project and was looking at it last night and noticed the flush brass plug on the engine side carb mating surface... I hope I didn't just waste $28 on that carb!

So a related question pertaining to the Zama replacements: I see that when I look up replacement carbs for the year 346 I am working on it lists the c3el17 and c3el18 carbs. My NE 346 is running the c3el32 if I recall. Can anyone tell me what differences exist between these carbs if any, and if they are of concern to me?? Obviously, my NE 346 carb has the fitting for the primer. When I swapped it into the primerless OE saw, I just capped it with a small vacuum line plug and it worked perfectly. I have a more permanent solution in mind if I end up getting a carb designed for a primer for this saw.

Another thing, I see I can pick up the genuine article Zama carbs on the bay for around $30. Online vendors have them priced a bit steeper, as much as $60. Being as this saw belongs to the Town of Vienna, I'm not sure how we could go about buying from ebay, or if it's even possible. But I don't see the sense in paying double for the carb...

 

[Simondo]

I really appreciate the advice fellas! I never knew these things had an accelerator pump and I would have been driving myself insane trying to figure out what the issue is. When I disassembled the carb to do the kit, I found it to be only slightly dirty inside, nothing that would lead me to believe the carb is not salvageable.

I'm still being a bum sitting in my lazy-boy right now. But I will go out and confirm whether or not it has the pump. I recently picked up an HDA175 for my 359 project and was looking at it last night and noticed the flush brass plug on the engine side carb mating surface... I hope I didn't just waste $28 on that carb!

So a related question pertaining to the Zama replacements: I see that when I look up replacement carbs for the year 346 I am working on it lists the c3el17 and c3el18 carbs. My NE 346 is running the c3el32 if I recall. Can anyone tell me what differences exist between these carbs if any, and if they are of concern to me?? Obviously, my NE 346 carb has the fitting for the primer. When I swapped it into the primerless OE saw, I just capped it with a small vacuum line plug and it worked perfectly. I have a more permanent solution in mind if I end up getting a carb designed for a primer for this saw.

Another thing, I see I can pick up the genuine article Zama carbs on the bay for around $30. Online vendors have them priced a bit steeper, as much as $60. Being as this saw belongs to the Town of Vienna, I'm not sure how we could go about buying from ebay, or if it's even possible. But I don't see the sense in paying double for the carb...

Thought it might give you a pointer as i only found out about the pump after much pain. Il hazard a guess that most differences on the Zama replacements are down to the primer set up and orientation of hook ups for throttle and choke. There not my thing as iv limited knowledge on Zama carbs as most of the things i deal with use Wallbro. I also would like to know if the primmer bulb Zama could just have the extra input blocked and work as a replacement on the first edition 346 as the second edition 346 Zama carb is easier to find.
Any 346 xp that comes back to life gets my vote Bud
Simon

 

[RIDE-RED 350r]

I should add that from what I have been able to search out, the HDA159 is NLA as well... Any OEM parts vendor page I look at lists the Zama c3el17 and c3el18 carbs as the OEM replacement for the OE346.

When I swapped my NE carb in, everything in terms of linkage hooked right up readily with no issues. The only difference the seems to exist is the primer line hookup. Other than capping that line, it seems to be a direct bolt-in replacement. I didn't even have to adjust the H and L jets, it started and ran like a good 346 oughtta!

My plan to address the primer line is to crimp it closed with a pair of wire cutters, (without actually cutting it) and put a drop of solder in the top.

One thing I like about the NE that is different than the OE is the air filter mounting/retention method. The OE has that 1/4 turn setup that seems kind of flimsy and failure prone to me, where my NE has the same type of retention that my 357/359 has... The wire retainer that swings over top of the filter and snaps into place... Migth have to upgrade that filter mount along with the carb.... Oh and the tank vent line connects to the air filter base so the tank pulls filtered air as it vents... Good idea there too.

 

[Simondo]

I should add that from what I have been able to search out, the HDA159 is NLA as well... Any OEM parts vendor page I look at lists the Zama c3el17 and c3el18 carbs as the OEM replacement for the OE346.

When I swapped my NE carb in, everything in terms of linkage hooked right up readily with no issues. The only difference the seems to exist is the primer line hookup. Other than capping that line, it seems to be a direct bolt-in replacement. I didn't even have to adjust the H and L jets, it started and ran like a good 346 oughtta!

My plan to address the primer line is to crimp it closed with a pair of wire cutters, (without actually cutting it) and put a drop of solder in the top.

One thing I like about the NE that is different than the OE is the air filter mounting/retention method. The OE has that 1/4 turn setup that seems kind of flimsy and failure prone to me, where my NE has the same type of retention that my 357/359 has... The wire retainer that swings over top of the filter and snaps into place... Migth have to upgrade that filter mount along with the carb.... Oh and the tank vent line connects to the air filter base so the tank pulls filtered air as it vents... Good idea there too.

I never got into the situation of hooking a Zama up on mine as it still is in a box, but the small amount of research i did showed a need to change air horn /filter mount. Totally agree the twist one is a weak design…but thats why the 2nd gen is better , all V logical
Could i sugest a rubber cap and a clip instead of a pertinent block off ? Im sure you won't use the carb on your Gen 2 but it might be useful if you need a sub to fault find on it ?

 

[RIDE-RED 350r]

Well, I'm certain that I won't need to run this carb on any of my saws, as the saw I am working on belongs to my employer.

I wonder what the reason is for stating that the airhorn needs to be replaced??? I wonder if it is intended to upgrade to the better filter mount?? But, I did in fact use the air horn from my NE when I swapped the carb, so it's likely there is truth to that...

Was just digging more and if ebay pictures accurately depict the c3 el18 carbs, they appear not to have the primer line fitting.

 

[Nitehawk55]

Make sure on the old carb that you put the metering diaphragm on top of the gasket . A lot of guys mix that up and they won't run right .

 

[RIDE-RED 350r]

Make sure on the old carb that you put the metering diaphragm on top of the gasket . A lot of guys mix that up and they won't run right .

Yes Sir, it has been confirmed to be installed in the correct order. I've made that mistake myself.

The other one that threw me for a loop awhile back was a 394 carb... I didn't catch that the metering diaphragm button was actually supposed to hook the needle top... You wouldn't believe the fuel it puked out the decomp and muffler before I figured out my mistake! LOL!

 

[XP_Slinger]

I was wrenching on my 372 when all of this was going on and the night and day difference between the two carbs cannot be understated. Wow did it come alive! Good info on the OE to NE carb swap.

 

[lwhaples]

Good read,Thanks for sharing.

 

[Simondo]

Well, I'm certain that I won't need to run this carb on any of my saws, as the saw I am working on belongs to my employer.

I wonder what the reason is for stating that the airhorn needs to be replaced??? I wonder if it is intended to upgrade to the better filter mount?? But, I did in fact use the air horn from my NE when I swapped the carb, so it's likely there is truth to that...

Was just digging more and if ebay pictures accurately depict the c3 el18 carbs, they appear not to have the primer line fitting.

I did so much looking over posts and info on those little suckers i just can't remember the exact reason for the recommended air horn swap. Could be the upgrade to new style filter or also using a 357 Zama carb on the 346 …But if you think it will just sub across without the filter change then that would be useful to know.

 

[RIDE-RED 350r]

I'll let you know.

 

[RIDE-RED 350r]

Well, I brought both my 346ne and the town's 346oe back to work with me today for some side by side comparisons of the filter mounts. The only difference is the NE mount is a little taller. Other than that, they interchange.

I will post pics when I get home from work.

 

[RIDE-RED 350r]

OK, so for future reference, the filter mounts will work on either carb, and any carb/filter mount combination will work on either OE or NE 346, with the exception that if running an OE style 346 carb that does not have the provisions for the primer line, you would have to disable or block off your primer line somehow..

But the benefit of using the NE style mount is a better air filter retention system.

Here are some side by side pics.

Pics of saw show the Zama c3-el32 from my NE346 installed with the OE filter mount in the OE 346.

I should also note that the NE filter mount has a fitting for connecting the tank vent line to the intake pipe beneath the air filter making it so the tank vent pulls filtered air... Good idea.

 

[Simondo]

Top notch info …most helpful . Thankyou for the effort you went to doing all of the above

 

[RIDE-RED 350r]

No problem!

With all of the help and advice I have received from members here in the past, this is the very least I could do.

Oh and forgot to mention, the HDA159 DOES in fact have the flush brass plug on the engine side of the carb mating surface, indicating the presence of the accelerator pump.... Which after being advised by you good folks here I have discerned to be non functional.

Boss gave me the green light to order up the Zama c3-el18, and the NE air filter mount and retainer to upgrade to the better air filter retention.

And if I am not overstepping any bounds, I would like to say that GKS (George Kahler Sales, my local Husky dealer) came in quite well on the carb price. I looked at other OEM vendors online and many have the Zama carb priced between $50 and $60. I was expecting GKS to be the same... They came in at $37 which is right on par with the prices on these carbs from Ebay sellers, which range from $30-$35. Kudos to GKS!

 

[Simondo]

Had a feeling that the HDA 159 would have the pump ..all the ones iv seen did . Glad you have been given the green light to do the further work as the 1st edition rev really well . Subtle the way the pump is installed isn't it and very easy not to notice until you have finally pulled ALL your hair out, drained the coffee pot …Twice ! and stomped around the yard howling "It was supposed to be such a easy fix " …"Why Meeeeee !! "

 

[RIDE-RED 350r]

Very frustrating indeed!!

Here I was doing a complete overhaul on this saw, all the way down to crank bearings... My friends at work kind of breaking my chops about whether or not the thing would ever run again... only to have this stupid little problem badger me like that...

I can't wait to show them how it runs with a properly functioning carb on it!