A new 357xp piston question

[Stump Shot]

That means he will be able to answer any and all questions about the sources right?

One way to find out.

 

[Duane(Pa)]

That thing will sale through wood with a .325. Recommend you go with an 8 pin rim as well. Do you have the proper clutch drum to run the small spline .325?

I was going to ask why there are two oil pump worms listed? Is the spline size different?

 

[decableguy2000]

I was going to ask why there are two oil pump worms listed? Is the spline size different?

This is from the 2011 ipl, as far as I could tell there is only one spline drum. Its the same in all the ipl's maybe it geared different for 3/8 vs .325

 

[decableguy2000]

I'm going to have to go look in my parts pile, it got me wondering if the drums are different, I have 2 different worms now but one is damaged, and I can't see the part numbers on them.

 

[Duane(Pa)]

I thought it was odd. Don’t mean to derail a piston thread...

 

[Spike60]

Yes the splines are different and there are 2 different drums. I'll post the different numbers and availability later this morning when I get to the store. Both with Husky and Oregon power mate options. The IPL above does show both options.

What's going on here is that Most 357's came with large spline 3/8 set ups. But 7 and 8 pin .325 rims are small spline afairs that require a different drum, and therefore a differenrt oil gear to mate with the drum. This is common to some other saws over the years like the 254/262. Even the 372 has such an option.

 

[Spike60]

Yes, the IPL above has it all there. Notice two part number 13's. 503 980 002 is the .325 set up. Retail is $40.

The Oregon powermate number is 108215X. Retail is $27, but it doesn't include the clutch bearing that you get with the Husky kit.

 

[Spike60]

I'm going to have to go look in my parts pile, it got me wondering if the drums are different, I have 2 different worms now but one is damaged, and I can't see the part numbers on them.

Be aware that the part number on the drum is for the drum only. It will not be the same as the part number in the IPL that includes a bearing and rim. The IPL doesn't have a drum only part number. All you really need to do is see if your drum accepts a small or large spline rim. Also worth noting is that the small spline drum still allows anyone to run a 3/8 set up using a small spline 3/8 rim.

 

[Derf]

Clear as mud

 

[David Young]

Win win between those two, both are light, nimble and have great power. I’m keeping both

Hoarder

 

[XP_Slinger]

Hoarder

Hate those guys

 

[Duane(Pa)]

Be aware that the part number on the drum is for the drum only. It will not be the same as the part number in the IPL that includes a bearing and rim. The IPL doesn't have a drum only part number. All you really need to do is see if your drum accepts a small or large spline rim. Also worth noting is that the small spline drum still allows anyone to run a 3/8 set up using a small spline 3/8 rim.

Thanks! Great info.

 

[Wolverine]

I thought it was odd. Don’t mean to derail a piston thread...

Thanks DW. You saved me from digging deep for this info. I just bought an all black Jonsered 2150 that some hack ported. I want to run 3/8 on it.

 

[decableguy2000]

I dug around the workbench a little bit today and found 2 worms, and 2 drums both were large spline. I'll see what I have for 3/8 small mount bars. I think the 9 pin .325 would be to much for this saw. I must of got the 346 drum mixed up on the bench. To many irons in the fire.

 

[old guy]

I tried the 9 pin .325, it was a bit much.

 

[Spike60]

Yeah, 9 pin would be a bit much for a 357. Plus a 9 pin usually means standard drive link counts don't work.

 

[XP_Slinger]

I tried the 9 pin .325, it was a bit much.

You ever try a .325 8 pin? I run one on my 254 and it pulls it great. Same diameter as a 3/8 7 pin.

 

[David Young]

So I actually need a 357XP piston, and thought I'd see about the LilRedBarn popup jobbie. I also hedged my bets and bought a Meteor. I took a bunch of crappy cell phone pics in case it helps anyone. My mics are at work so I can't measure tolerances. I'm too lazy to pull out my digital scale and weigh them right now. The OEM piston is out in the garage still on the crank so no comparison to that right now either. The LilRedBarn is more expensive than Meteor, but I really think it should be the other way around.

First pic is the LilRedBarn (top) and the Meteor (bottom) side by side. The machining on the LilRedBarn piston top is more pronounced. If you run your fingernail over the surface grooves the LilRedBarn is louder than the meteor. That comes from running a tool at faster feeds and speeds. It produces more of a roughing cut than a finish cut. The finish is finer, and in my opinion nicer, on the Meteor. However, this probably will make zero difference in how it runs.
View attachment 210397

Next up is the side profile of the LilRedBarn. The finish continues down the side of the piston skirt. It might actually be an advantage to hold oil better, I don't know. On the sides of the piston below the piston pin bore, the bottom edge of the piston skirt looks like it was hand-finished with a grinder, as evidenced by what looks like chatter; it doesn't look like a uniform CNC machining job. The inside surfaces of the piston pin bore boss (toward the center of the piston) are non machined. The unmachined cast area on the outside of the piston around the piston pin bore has micro-chips at the edges where it meets the machined wall indicative of dull tooling being used.
View attachment 210394

The next picture is the Meteor. The smooth finish continues down the side walls of the piston skirt. The un-machined casting around the pin bore looks better to me than the LilRedBarn. The inside surface of the piston pin bore boss is machined. The bottom edge of the piston on the sides is not finished by hand or machine, but the machining of the piston skirt left no noticeable burr that necessitates chamfering that edge.
View attachment 210395

Here is the bottom of the LilRedBarn. The entire bottom edge of the piston is un-machined raw casting. There is casting flash on the pin bore boss (bottom side boss in the photo) because it is an unmachined surface. The casting has a dull finish.
View attachment 210393

And here is the bottom of the Meteor. The bottom of the front and back skirt is machined. As mentioned before, the inside bosses of the pin bore are machined. In general the cast aluminum has more of a gloss finish to it.
View attachment 210396

Thank you for the assesment from a parts maker perspective. its tough to tell what actually makes a difference in performance but method and attention to detail give an idea of over all quality of the product.

 

[old guy]

You ever try a .325 8 pin? I run one on my 254 and it pulls it great. Same diameter as a 3/8 7 pin.

I have not, But will next summer. Ive got a couple of high torque 359s that should handle that gleefully.

 

[Duke Thieroff]

Think I found them at "Duke's", who ever that is.

Yep, that'd be me.
My real name is Chris, the nickname Duke started about 10 years ago on AS. I don't frequent the forums much anymore but I still check in from time to time.

That means he will be able to answer any and all questions about the sources right?

Hey, yeah I probably could. Frankly speaking, pop-ups are currently coming from 2 sources I know of. Hyway and VEC in India, which are copies of the Hyway slugs. I've stocked both, personally prefer the Hyway.
VEC is pretty cool because they have a really nice catalog of pistons that are tough to find. I think they make the Golf packaged ones as well.

I see some talk about LRB in this thread as well. Lee at LRB also has had a lot of pistons developed over the years that are unavailable through some sources. I stock and sell some of the oddball ones. Very little problems with them in my experiences and they help a lot of people get their equipment running again. In some circumstances they fit the bill just fine. I don't stock normally these where we could stock a Meteor. For a lot of models we also offer cheaper unbranded pistons. A lot of our customers find good use from them. Sometimes there's issues. If anyone has bought a TS760/076 piston that has originated in China lately I'm sure they can attest to this.

I think you'll find some differences between the two if you measure. I know for sure after selling a lot of aftermarket there are some variances from batch-to-batch and from manufacturer to manufacturer. For the most part the most amount of engineering that goes into a lot of parts is just in the copying of it. Which leads to the next thing of why there is such a variance in pricing between OEM and aftermarket stuff, in my summation it is a result of the following.

• OEMs bear the costs of R&D
• OEMs typically have Quality Control programs/employees

I'm sure there's way more to it, but I'm just a seller of parts, not a developer or a manufacturer. Simply put, aftermarket parts aren't really engineered parts, but copies. The quality of the parts depends on the quality of the work of the people and materials used in the manufacturing processes. We all know the $2 Farmertec piston is going to have a marked difference between the $40 Meteor or the $80 OEM. It's just the way it is.


Really the bottom line is we stock and source parts from all over the world and through various sources. Most of the times we can deliver good parts to our customers that they are satisfied with for a fair price. When we have issues we back it up, plain and simple.

We don't give our customers the "techniscist said OK to run" bit