240 Volt Wiring

[Marshy]

My wife gives the best birthday presents!

 

[huskihl]

My wife gives the best birthday presents!
View attachment 187002

Those work well

 

[Larry B]

Nice. Tell her my birthday is in September. Just saying

 

[Marshy]

Those work well

I couldn't justify getting anything smaller. The Hobart machines are made by Miller supposedly.

 

[Lightning Performance]

I couldn't justify getting anything smaller. The Hobart machines are made by Miller supposedly.

Your better off with that. My 120V Snapon needs a lil help with gasses when welding over 3/16". Perfect for 5/32" and sheet.

 

[cgraham1]

Using the same plug (breaker) for both the generator back feed and running a welder is IMO a bad idea. Get some kind of interlock and dedicate that to the generator only. And just put in a second breaker/plug for the welder. Cheap insurance.

 

[Marshy]

Using the same plug (breaker) for both the generator back feed and running a welder is IMO a bad idea. Get some kind of interlock and dedicate that to the generator only. And just put in a second breaker/plug for the welder. Cheap insurance.

Can you explain what your concern is? Only thing that does is makes a dedicated plug for the generator and makes more work for me to install another breaker/wire/receptical. I'm open to opinions but want to understand the concern if there is one.

 

[cgraham1]

Can you explain what your concern is? Only thing that does is makes a dedicated plug for the generator and makes more work for me to install another breaker/wire/receptical. I'm open to opinions but want to understand the concern if there is one.

Well what will happen if you fire up your generator and forget to turn off the main breaker on your panel?

 

[Skeans1]

My wife gives the best birthday presents!
View attachment 187002

Nice little machine, I’ve never cared for the tap style settings of those kinds of machines. If you ever decide to upgrade Everlast stuff has treated me pretty well for heavy duty tig/stick and then heavy duty plasma cutting.

What kind of wire are you planning on running through it?


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[cgraham1]

@Marshy

”Electricity comes into a home from the utility via a transformer. The transformer lowers the voltage from thousands of volts down to 240 volts before it enters the home. Powering a home with a portable generator during a power outage by connecting it to an appliance or convenience outlet is called backfeeding. This allows electrical power to enter the main panel through the outlet’s branch circuit breaker. The panel distributes the power to the rest of the house through the other branch circuit breakers. It also feeds power out through the main breaker to the transformer, which then converts it back to thousand of volts and attempts to energize all neighborhood utility lines.

Energizing the utility lines in this fashion is dangerous and illegal. Workers attempting to restore power to the neighborhood may unexpectedly encounter high voltage on the utility lines and suffer a fatal shock.

If the main breaker is turned off, it alleviates the hazard, but that requires remembering to shut the breaker off, and relies solely on the user to do so. There is no guarantee that someone else will not turn the main breaker back on and suddenly energize the neighborhood wires. There is no safeguard in this arrangement.“

Building code requires some sort of mechanical interlock to prevent this from happening. You might remember, but what about your wife? Or your teenage kids?

Here’s what I put on mine. Simple but effective.

 

[cgraham1]

More generator fun.

https://www.electricgeneratorsdirect.com/amp/stories/13-How-NOT-to-Connect-a-Portable-Generator.html

 

[Marshy]

@Marshy

”Electricity comes into a home from the utility via a transformer. The transformer lowers the voltage from thousands of volts down to 240 volts before it enters the home. Powering a home with a portable generator during a power outage by connecting it to an appliance or convenience outlet is called backfeeding. This allows electrical power to enter the main panel through the outlet’s branch circuit breaker. The panel distributes the power to the rest of the house through the other branch circuit breakers. It also feeds power out through the main breaker to the transformer, which then converts it back to thousand of volts and attempts to energize all neighborhood utility lines.

Energizing the utility lines in this fashion is dangerous and illegal. Workers attempting to restore power to the neighborhood may unexpectedly encounter high voltage on the utility lines and suffer a fatal shock.

If the main breaker is turned off, it alleviates the hazard, but that requires remembering to shut the breaker off, and relies solely on the user to do so. There is no guarantee that someone else will not turn the main breaker back on and suddenly energize the neighborhood wires. There is no safeguard in this arrangement.“

Building code requires some sort of mechanical interlock to prevent this from happening. You might remember, but what about your wife? Or your teenage kids?

Here’s what I put on mine. Simple but effective.

View attachment 207983 View attachment 207984 View attachment 207985

I am aware of what happens if the main isnt disconnected when running the generator. I appreciate your concern but I will not be rewiring my entire main pannel to accommodate the lockout to run the generator. If I used the generator more often and ran the risk of being complacent then I would agree but I dont use it only once every other year, up to 2 times a year.

The gen plug is connected to the garage sub pannel and that breaker is not at the top of my main pannel. It would require a lot of reconfiguring to make a lock out plate work. My wife is never going to hook it up and use it and my kids are not old enough (6&7).

 

[Marshy]

Nice little machine, I’ve never cared for the tap style settings of those kinds of machines. If you ever decide to upgrade Everlast stuff has treated me pretty well for heavy duty tig/stick and then heavy duty plasma cutting.

What kind of wire are you planning on running through it?


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I debated between a stick vs mig for a while. I just dont need to weld heavy stuff that often. I can hardly justify the mig but I bought the 190 because it can weld a little thicker material. I use the flux core wire that came in it and need a new spool. IIRC it can run up to 0.030" wire so I planned to use that. What ever they sell at tractor supply is what I planned to buy. I do have a local Haun welding supply store though. I'll probably get my gas from him.

 

[Lightning Performance]

I debated between a stick vs mig for a while. I just dont need to weld heavy stuff that often. I can hardly justify the mig but I bought the 190 because it can weld a little thicker material. I use the flux core wire that came in it and need a new spool. IIRC it can run up to 0.030" wire so I planned to use that. What ever they sell at tractor supply is what I planned to buy. I do have a local Haun welding supply store though. I'll probably get my gas from him.

Gas ain't cheap but I never weld with flux core. Hate it.

 

[Marshy]

Gas ain't cheap but I never weld with flux core. Hate it.

No, about $300 for the small bottle and another 30 or 60 to fill it. I was happy to run the flux core out. Welds like *s-word!

 

[backhoelover]

No, about $300 for the small bottle and another 30 or 60 to fill it. I was happy to run the flux core out. Welds like *s-word!

is there a arc 3 in your area? mine was 225 filled i own the bottle too.

 

[Larry B]

I used to get my welding supplies from a local company called weiler welding. They got bought out by Airgas. To be nice i will just say they are butt holes to deal with and they don't care about the small customer. I had a 99yr lease on a mig gas bottle from weiler when i went in to have it filled at Airgas the said all the old weiler leases were gone and i needed to start a new one with them for ridiculous dollars. They were upset i had not returned the bottle sooner. Real turds. Indiana Oxygen recently opened an office in Dayton and i get my gas and supplies from them. They actually seem to want my business. Unless you are a big shop i would avoid Airgas. If i treated customers like they treated me i wouldn't have many customers.

 

[cgraham1]

I am aware of what happens if the main isnt disconnected when running the generator. I appreciate your concern but I will not be rewiring my entire main pannel to accommodate the lockout to run the generator. If I used the generator more often and ran the risk of being complacent then I would agree but I dont use it only once every other year, up to 2 times a year.

The gen plug is connected to the garage sub pannel and that breaker is not at the top of my main pannel. It would require a lot of reconfiguring to make a lock out plate work. My wife is never going to hook it up and use it and my kids are not old enough (6&7).

Well you asked why I was concerned... but I guess you knew the answer already.

I’m a common sense type of person, but I just feel better knowing that there is no possible way to have the generator and the main power hooked to the house at the same time.

It’s your house and you can hook it up how you want, but hopefully anyone reading along and didn’t know why it could be a problem, will know now.

 

[Skeans1]

I debated between a stick vs mig for a while. I just dont need to weld heavy stuff that often. I can hardly justify the mig but I bought the 190 because it can weld a little thicker material. I use the flux core wire that came in it and need a new spool. IIRC it can run up to 0.030" wire so I planned to use that. What ever they sell at tractor supply is what I planned to buy. I do have a local Haun welding supply store though. I'll probably get my gas from him.

Gas ain't cheap but I never weld with flux core. Hate it.

If I’m going to do any mig it’s sure isn’t going to be short circuit mig hard wire, I’d look into dual shield flux cored it’s a wire that runs a gas plus has a flux it burns hot and fast. It’s available in 035 as well, it’s an all position wire unlike spray transfer mig and you can run it on lighter gauge materials the only thing besides normally c25 gas that’s needed is different drive rollers like flux core wire uses.

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[Marshy]

Well you asked why I was concerned... but I guess you knew the answer already.

I’m a common sense type of person, but I just feel better knowing that there is no possible way to have the generator and the main power hooked to the house at the same time.

It’s your house and you can hook it up how you want, but hopefully anyone reading along and didn’t know why it could be a problem, will know now.

I sincerely appreciate your concern. I hope it didn't come across any other way. Thank you.

I just wanted to understand the technical aspect. I always open to opinions. Just because I choose not to follow it doesn't mean I don't appreciate it. I'll even add, I would recommend anyone reading this to heed your advice.