Tsumara bars issue

[Redbull661]

I agree. I doubt I am alone with this issue. I also do not see how this could be some odd one off bar either. Certainly not real user friendly.

I spoke with my distributor - no other dealer or customer has had this issue. No complaints on this particular bar at all. You may have a bad bar. I've sent this thread on to my distributor.

edit - my distributor would like to replace the bar. PM sent.

Page 29 is interesting. (see attached) It talks about chain stretch and worn rim sprockets.

 

[CR888]

I agree. I doubt I am alone with this issue. I also do not see how this could be some odd one off bar either. Certainly not real user friendly.

I just took a look through the factory catalogue and all the 32" RSN bars whether its husky mount or Stihl (A010) are 105DL in 3/8. So I'm at a loss as to what's going on, something is different for a reason but they 'should' be 105DL. Being laser cut off by a computer driven pattern size mistakes just don't happen, their are several finishing stages that are done by hand so someone you would think would notice any irregularities.

 

[CR888]

You should post up the part no on the bar, not the nose, just to see if it started off as another pitch bar & had its nose swapped to 3/8. That's the only thing I can think of, sometimes the only way suppliers can shift old stock bars is if they make them a popular pitch like 3/8. I know they make some oddball bars like 32" & 36" .325 for example.

 

[huskyboy]

I spoke with my distributor - no other dealer or customer has had this issue. No complaints on this particular bar at all. You may have a bad bar. I've sent this thread on to my distributor.

edit - my distributor would like to replace the bar. PM sent.

Page 29 is interesting. (see attached) It talks about chain stretch and worn rim sprockets.

Wow, that’s a standup distributor you have! Interested to see if this resolves the issue.

 

[Philbert]

edit - my distributor would like to replace the bar. PM sent

Great outcome!

(Send me that defective one for proper disposal!)

Philbert

 

[Redbull661]

at distributor... this is 1 of 2 isles of various bars they stock.

 

[luckydad]

First thing we did was count drivers. Next we tried two new Stihl chains. I hate to break bunches of chains down for this bar but will if I have too. I think the issue is it is not a 105 dl 32" bar...it is a 104 dl bar.

Custom length chains in a commercial setting is not good. Having standard stock length loops is a great thing. I feel responsible for suggesting this and it is not what it should be.

This is exactly why I don’t run these bars. I had the same problem Jimmy.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[00wyk]

It's one way to tell if it is a Tsumura bar - they all have 'E' for their drive link designation. I dunno if it's just code or if it is shorthand for a japanese word.

I have a 32 inch Tsumura 105DL - fits fine on a 288XP.
I also have an Iggesund Forest 30 inch d009 bar that I had to cut off the end and add a new hole to fit a Stihl mount.

I thought this thread was sort of odd, so I went back and checked the bar on our 288 to be sure. It actually states 102E and not 105E.
I double checked the chains, they are 102DL. Shrug.

 

[Jimmy in NC]

Ok here is a quick update...

Redbull661's distributor did not send a no charge replacement as the bar was not from that distributor; it was from ComStock Loggin in NY.

ComStock gave full refund after 3.5 weeks. They are top notch in my book.

Customer said get another bar, so we got one from @Redbull661 which shipped super fast.

Bar arrived Friday afternoon and yesterday [Saturday] I did the "Pepsi Challenge" with my OEM 066, some bars, and a new loop of 33RS chain [Stihl 3/8 Full Chisel Full Comp]. Remember this loop has never been run so it will stretch. Bars tried are an Stihl OEM 32" / 105 dl, Tsumara #1, Tsumara #2 from @Redbull661 , Cannon Superbar. Some questions were raised if the drive sprocket was worn so I installed a brand new 3/8-7 rim sprocket before any were mounted. Bars were not 'tipped up's for installation so I could potentially tighten these more.

Stihl OEM bar...fits the best. Note the adjusting slot to the bar pad opening. This bar has a lot of use on both OEM saws and a Husky 394.

Tsumara #1 from ComStock. 4 days of commercial cutting. Note the burn mark...adjusted all the way out the oiler does not line up super swift.

Tsumara #2 from @Redbull661 This bar has zero run time.

Cannon Superbar - not as good as the OEM bar but better than the Tsumara. This bar has zero run time on it.

 

[Jimmy in NC]

At this point I am waiting for the customer to tell me what they want to do. They like the Tsumara weight / feel according to them. (I have not done the research to see the weight difference nor do I really care. It may all be perceived at this point.)

My concern is with 105 DL that gives you 210 pivot pins / rivets. If each pin wears 0.003" over the life of the chain you gain 0.63" of overall length. Split that in half and you need 0.315" (roughly 5/16") of adjustment range to get back to the same tension of current. At this point I do not see that much adjustment available on the Tusumara bars. It is questionable if there is that much on the Cannon bar. I stand behind my previous findings that in a production setting these should be labeled as a 104dl bar which would pull 0.730" out of the total chain length and all of a sudden everything lines up better and works better. Also moving the tail closer to the rim helps keeping the chain from derailing and such.

 

[Jimmy in NC]

One more picture. This shows where the adjuster is in relation to front bar stud when at full travel. As you can see here opening the bar tail slot would do nothing as the adjust is about at the end of the travel in the previous pictures.

 

[huskyboy]

Could you drill another bar adjustment hole ahead of the one already there? Just trying to think of a resolution. Seems like a pain having to make up 104dl chain every time you need one, especially for a tree guy where they just want to quickly throw on a new chain out of box and go to work.

 

[Jimmy in NC]

Could you drill another bar adjustment hole ahead of the one already there? Just trying to think of a resolution. Seems like a pain having to make up 104dl chain every time you need one, especially for a tree guy where they just want to quickly throw on a new chain out of box and go to work.

If you put a hole ahead of the current adjuster hole it would move the bar toward the crank centerline. Put it behind and you would be cutting the tail out of bar. Also note as you have more open space between the rim and bar tail it is more open for chain tossing and such. The other issue is as the bar moves further out the oiler doesn't line up as well. It is a cascading issue.

 

[Jimmy in NC]

I have a theory that I hope helps to figure this out for sure today. Leaving this meeting and headed to spend more money.

 

[Jimmy in NC]

Well the results are in. Stopped and bought an OEM new bar...not wide nose. Same chain, rim, saw, tail gate. It fits great.

Laying the Tsumara on top of the Stihl the issues glare at you. The Tsumara is shorter and has a narrower tail profile. Running an 8 pin or larger could be an issue in a work setting if the chain got a bit loose.

None of these are huge issues but much like a Kit saw... cumulative error adds up.

 

[RI Chevy]

Very shocked to hear these issues. Glad you got it figured out...[emoji106]

 

[Czed]

Tsumura doesn't like the germans apparently.
I've hung them on swedish saws since the 80s
Never an issue with adjustments.

 

[Jimmy in NC]

Tsumura doesn't like the germans apparently.
I've hung them on swedish saws since the 80s
Never an issue with adjustments.

Well looking at the Husky Tsumara I have here, it's a different blank yet. I had thought Tsumara was making both Stihl 12mm and Husky 9mm bars from the same blank and just machining the tail differently; they are NOT. They are certainly different blanks they are machining for each. The overall length is the exact same. The Husky has a broader tail quicker. Very slight differences but differences.

Nobody take this thread wrong, I like the Tsumara bars but be aware that you may have a few tweaks to work through. I will say my 32" Husky fits great on my 395 and the 28" I got from @Redbull661 setup with .404 works great on this customer's other 066. I do not know if this is a long bar issue?


Husky mount on bottom.

 

[RI Chevy]

This is so interesting here...
I wonder why they didn't just make an exact copy of the OEM bars?

 

[AuerX]

This is so interesting here...
I wonder why they didn't just make an exact copy of the OEM bars?

Indeed. Seems bizarre they wouldn't match OEM exactly.