log splitter goof...now what?

[singinwoodwackr]

so, I had to remove and weld the valve cap on my old splitter the other day and managed to pop the spring loaded portion...oops.
At least I found all the ball bearings and spring

but, now I can't get it all back together. I believe that center ball needs to be below the smaller ones when the top ring is in place. There is a small spring just under the ball. I'm also not sure which way that top collar goes, note the groove on one end that the smaller balls rides. I have tried installing the cap and pulling up on the lever...no joy.
suggestions?

 

[hacskaroly]

I have never worked on one of these before, do the four small bearings come out or are they kind of pressed into place?

If they come out, I would imagine that you have the spring in there, push it down with the large bearing and then put the four small bearings in. When it comes to the top collar, if you put the small bearing groove towards the top, would the way the collar sit, allow for the small bearings to expand out (into the groove) or are the two mismatched?

Not sure if this crayon drawing will help with what I am thinking:

I am guessing that the spring (orange) pushes up on the large bearing (blue) which causes the four small bearings (green) to then push out into the collar groove. When the pressure is relieved, the spring settles back, causing the four green balls to push back and cause the blue ball to recede back.

Again...this is a guess on my part.

 

[singinwoodwackr]

I have never worked on one of these before, do the four small bearings come out or are they kind of pressed into place?

If they come out, I would imagine that you have the spring in there, push it down with the large bearing and then put the four small bearings in. When it comes to the top collar, if you put the small bearing groove towards the top, would the way the collar sit, allow for the small bearings to expand out (into the groove) or are the two mismatched?

Not sure if this crayon drawing will help with what I am thinking:

View attachment 488477 I am guessing that the spring (orange) pushes up on the large bearing (blue) which causes the four small bearings (green) to then push out into the collar groove. When the pressure is relieved, the spring settles back, causing the four green balls to push back and cause the blue ball to recede back.

Again...this is a guess on my part.

Correct. That is my understanding of the mechanism

 

[hacskaroly]

Correct. That is my understanding of the mechanism

Ok, I found some instructions if the detent is too low or to high, not sure if either of the steps (if there are specific steps) will help:

Adjust the detent valve if it is set too low​

If the control lever of the log splitter pops into neutral on its own before the rod has fully retreated, it’ll mean that the detent adjustment has been set too low. To do so, you’ll need to carry out the following steps –

1. Turn off the log splitter’s engine
2. Relieve fluid pressure of the system by cycling the control lever a couple of times
3. Put the control lever of the machine in the neutral position
4. Loosen the locking nut on the log splitter’s return detent adjustment bolt
5. Now, turn the bolt clockwise 1/4 turn for tightening the relief spring
6. Start the log splitter’s engine and test the detent valve
7. Now repeat steps 1st to 6th until the detent valve starts functioning correctly
8. Tighten the locking nut

In case the control lever is in the return position after the cylinder rod has fully retracted, it’ll mean that the detent adjustment has been set too high. To do so, you’ll need to carry out the following steps –​

1. Turn off the log splitter’s engine
2. Relieve fluid pressure by cycling the control lever a couple of times
3. Put the log splitter’s control lever in the neutral position
4. Loosen up the locking nut on the return detent adjustment bolt
5. Now, turn the bolt counterclockwise 4-5 turns
6. Start the log splitter’s engine and then test the valve
7. If the control lever still remains in the detent return position after the rod has fully retracted, you should repeat steps 1st to 3rd
   
8. Turn the bolt counterclockwise a couple of times more and then repeat step 6th
9. Now, repeat steps 7th and 8th if necessary
10. If the control lever doesn’t stay in the detent return position on its own, you should repeat steps 1st to 3rd
11. Turn the detent adjustment bolt ¼ at a time until the control lever is in the detent while the rod is retracting, but it should also pop into neutral on its own once the rod is fully retracted
12. Make sure that you’re turning off the engine, relieve pressure in the system by cycling the control lever a couple of times and put the control lever in the neutral position between every adjustment
13. Lastly, tighten the locking nut

 

[hacskaroly]

Since you had parts flying all over, maybe the detent valve replacement instructions might be helpful:

How to replace the detent valve?​

If the detent valve is broken or isn’t working properly, you’ll need to replace it. Here are the instructions on how to replace the detent valve –

1. Once again, you’ll need to remove the detent cover
2. After that, unscrew the adjustment bolt all the way to remove the detent assembly from the hydraulic control valve
3. Make sure that you wipe away any oil and debris from the detent base before you install the new detent valve (remember not to use a scraper or anything that could gauge the base as it might cause a hydraulic leak)
4. Once the detent arrives, it’ll get shipped with the detent assembly already assembled and set in the new detent cover
5. The detent cover assembly will be shipped preassembled, you’ll need to remove the detent assembly from the detent cover (Caution – Remember to do this carefully. When sliding the detent assembly out of the detent cover, you shouldn’t allow the assembly to come apart. There will be small bearings inside the detent assembly, held in place by the detent sleeve.)
6. You shouldn’t allow the detent sleeve to slide up and improper.
7. Carefully, thread the detent into the base threads of the control valve
8. After that, tighten it all the way manually while ensuring that you don’t allow the threads to be crossed
9. Once it’s in place, snug down the assembly using a large slotted screwdriver
10. When you’re installing the new detent assembly, pack the top bearing using grease if it didn’t come greased by the manufacturer
11. Now, it’ll be time to screw on the new detent cover and then try it out
12. You might have to tighten down the slotted sleeve if it isn’t holding the control lever into the return position

 

[singinwoodwackr]

Don't need to adjust it...just need to get it back together

 

[hacskaroly]

Don't need to adjust it...just need to get it back together

I get that, I just wasn't sure if there was something in the adjustment process that would re-prime that setup or re-align something...

 

[singinwoodwackr]

I get that, I just wasn't sure if there was something in the adjustment process that would re-prime that setup or re-align something...

Ah, I wonder if that's how you have to get it back together...good question.
I was hoping somebody here had worked on one of these who would know.

 

[hacskaroly]

I was hoping somebody here had worked on one of these who would know.

I did a little more looking on YouTube and found a video that probably goes into more detail about working on the valve than what you are looking for, but it shows the tear down and rebuild step by step. The guy has a pretty good idea when it comes to putting in the large ball bearing and the collar. Hopefully this video helps!

On yours, it is looking a little grimy inside with the bearings and the spring, hard to tell from the picture if it is just dirty or greasy, if a little dry, may stand to use some more grease.

 

[legdelimber]

Not certain if it's just lighting or grease.. or just my danged eyesight again.
The grove that the 4 smaller balls ride in, is the groove worn in a bit deeper than factory spec?
Might just be grease hanging on the edges of the groove?
If the groove is worn, seems like the big ball might "settle" a bit out of place at some point of operation.
If the big ball is a little offset in its travel range, what happens to the flow and controllablity of things?

 

[singinwoodwackr]

I did a little more looking on YouTube and found a video that probably goes into more detail about working on the valve than what you are looking for, but it shows the tear down and rebuild step by step. The guy has a pretty good idea when it comes to putting in the large ball bearing and the collar. Hopefully this video helps!

On yours, it is looking a little grimy inside with the bearings and the spring, hard to tell from the picture if it is just dirty or greasy, if a little dry, may stand to use some more grease.

View attachment 488503

Just found this, lol.
Procedure at the end of the vid
Won’t even need to remove the valve from the splitter…

 

[hacskaroly]

Good luck, hope it works for you!! Heck, and I learned something too!!

 

[heimannm]

Bigger hammer...

 

[hacskaroly]

Won’t even need to remove the valve from the splitter…

Did it work??!? Did it work??!? Did it work??!? Huh?? Huh?? Huh???

 

[singinwoodwackr]

Bigger hammer...

Old story…

I took an engine machining class at the local JC back in ‘77. The guy running it was an old farmer and Arkansas transplant to Merced, CA.
First day of class was instruction on the various tools and how to use them.
His first rule, “anything can be fixed with a hammer.” “If you are having trouble, get a bigger hammer.” “Here, there are no excuses; there’s a 20# sledge in the tool cage.” It was fun to watch student’s reactions to whether he was serious or not, lol.