How to square file

[ChipsFlyin]

Worn out work chain, bout the last filing here.
View attachment 148878

Nice chain! It looks like it lived a good life.
I have a question. I'm curious how it cuts and self feeds? I downloaded the pic and threw some 90s with the chain and bar then a protractor to see what the cutters cutting angle figures out to. It's close to 2.5 degrees. 6 -6.5 degrees is the regular setting so I try to keep my chains close to that. It looks like a bunch off the raker but has been working for me. Am I thinking right?

 

[RI Chevy]

I had to do a hand stand to view those pics. Lol
How does the chain cut?

 

[ChipsFlyin]

I had to do a hand stand to view those pics. Lol
How does the chain cut?

Sorry, I had to do the pics upside down to reference the protractor angles. That's Deets' chain pic. I don't know how it cuts. That's what I was asking.

 

[RI Chevy]

Lol. Just funnin ya. If it's a Deets chain I bet it cuts like a hot knife through butter.

 

[Deets066]

Haven’t ran it yet, bucked some wood yesterday but it was kinda dirty. So I stuck with my round chain

 

[Deets066]

Nice chain! It looks like it lived a good life.
I have a question. I'm curious how it cuts and self feeds? I downloaded the pic and threw some 90s with the chain and bar then a protractor to see what the cutters cutting angle figures out to. It's close to 2.5 degrees. 6 -6.5 degrees is the regular setting so I try to keep my chains close to that. It looks like a bunch off the raker but has been working for me. Am I thinking right?View attachment 149421 View attachment 149422 View attachment 149423

That’s some fancy stuff you got goin on there.


As for raker height, I just use my file-o-plate gauge

 

[Wolverine]

I'm curious about the "stoning" of the chain.

And I'm also curious about the raker mod, making them almost upright and straight. It also looks like a LOT of weight is ground out of the chain. Which I'm sure, a lot of it is only for race chains and not work chains.

Not sure if that was ever replied to. I mount the chain on the saw backward and give it just enough throttle to spin the chain as slow as possible and use this to make the side plates more precise. EDIT - Very dangerous technique. Try it at your own risk! I wear welding gloves to hold the stone.

And yes, for smaller cc saws making the chain very light is an advantage (race chains).

 

[ChipsFlyin]

That’s some fancy stuff you got goin on there.


As for raker height, I just use my file-o-plate gauge

I have been super curious about chain factors since I got the MOFO hybrid. I hear about and see all these fast chains and know a super nice cutter and a strong saw is not enough to make something top notch fast. Raker height is one component that changes with the length of the gullet so am doing some nerdy research trying to see what angles work. There's soo many factors. The raker height could change again depending on what kind of wood. I'm no worrying about racing saws just maybe a little more speedy fun.

 

[Duane(Pa)]

I started checking/setting rakers with a feeler gauge. I found that .025 doesn't come close to self feeding in the hard dead oak I usually cut.(this is with square ground firewood chain) I was leery of lowering them for fear of getting too low, but I was able to get good results somewhere around .035 or a little more. I lowered them until it cut/fed the way I wanted then measured...


IDK what a cant wood chain would need, horse of a different color

 

[ChipsFlyin]

I started checking/setting rakers with a feeler gauge. I found that .025 doesn't come close to self feeding in the hard dead oak I usually cut. I was leery of lowering them for fear of getting too low, but I was able to get good results somewhere around .035 or a little more. IDK what a cant wood chain would need, horse of a different color

Everything you just said is because as the gullet lengthens due to the cutter being filed/ground back the cutting angle of the cutter decreases lessening the ability of self feeding at .025.

 

[Hedgerow]

Everything you just said is because as the gullet lengthens due to the cutter being filed/ground back the cutting angle of the cutter decreases lessening the ability of self feeding at .025.

Correct.
It's the angle of engagement that matters on the cutter. The guys that mill a lot like 6 degrees or so.

 

[ChipsFlyin]

Correct.
It's the angle of engagement that matters on the cutter. The guys that mill a lot like 6 degrees or so.

There you are. You know all the chain stuff.

 

[huskihl]

I started checking/setting rakers with a feeler gauge. I found that .025 doesn't come close to self feeding in the hard dead oak I usually cut.(this is with square ground firewood chain) I was leery of lowering them for fear of getting too low, but I was able to get good results somewhere around .035 or a little more. I lowered them until it cut/fed the way I wanted then measured...


IDK what a cant wood chain would need, horse of a different color

The under side angle of the top plate has nearly has much to do with aggressiveness as the raker does. Dallas sent me one of his first chains with his first square grinder and it required .035 to self feed on an 044. I always figured that chain would have lasted five tanks or more cutting clean wood. The way we've been grinding chains since, .025 raker height is plenty to get the chain to self feed. Round filed chains are the same way. If the file is held high in the tooth where there isn't much hook, it requires lower rakers to self feed, but lasts considerably longer. Take that same chain and lower the round file .050 and it will be considerably more aggressive

 

[Duane(Pa)]

"The way we've been grinding chains since, .025 raker height is plenty to get the chain to self feed."

So, these have a shallower underside angle of the top plate or steeper? Also, I have some forward lean on the side plate, but it's not crazy

 

[huskihl]

"The way we've been grinding chains since, .025 raker height is plenty to get the chain to self feed."

So, these have a shallower underside angle of the top plate or steeper? Also, I have some forward lean on the side plate, but it's not crazy

Yes. Sharper under side angle. As in, if hand filing, your file would be pointing back more, rather than down. The downside obviously, is longevity

 

[huskihl]

Also, I have some forward lean on the side plate, but it's not crazy

To me, forward lean acts very similar to an aggressive underside top plate angle. It will definitely make the chain more aggressive.
Something to think about... What if you ground or filed a chain with a few degrees of forward lean for aggressiveness and also filed a more blunt angle on the underside of the cutter? It might be aggressive and last a good long while with a normal raker height

 

[moparnut88]

To me, forward lean acts very similar to an aggressive underside top plate angle. It will definitely make the chain more aggressive.
Something to think about... What if you ground or filed a chain with a few degrees of forward lean for aggressiveness and also filed a more blunt angle on the underside of the cutter? It might be aggressive and last a good long while with a normal raker height

That's more what I do. Add several degrees of forward lean not as aggressive top plate and I lower my rakers to the soft setting on a husky guage generally they self feed well and are durable. I'd like to see some others version of this.

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[Duane(Pa)]

Yes. Sharper under side angle. As in, if hand filing, your file would be pointing back more, rather than down. The downside obviously, is longevity

I have looked at the top cutting edge with a magnifier on some worn chain, just amazing that wood can win the battle with steel but it does...

 

[Duane(Pa)]

That's more what I do. Add several degrees of forward lean not as aggressive top plate and I lower my rakers to the soft setting on a husky guage generally they self feed well and are durable. I'd like to see some others version of this.

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Have you ever measured the result of the soft setting? I was getting chatter which sucks, so I took to measuring my rakers.

 

[moparnut88]

Have you ever measured the result of the soft setting? I was getting chatter which sucks, so I took to measuring my rakers.

No I hanvent I need to most of my saws are AWOL so I've got more power than stock and have a hard to loading them without running an 8pin all the time. I've been tring to load my 2171 lately so to save some bar wear but haven't gotten the chain aggressive enough I guess.

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