Does Muffler Modding alone help a 462?

[rumatt]

According to this video, it does not. Did they just make too big of a hole?

Discuss.

 

[jackjcc]

Too big of a hole is the wrong word, it is large but I would venture a guess that it is optimized for the exhaust port and muffler chamber to produce peak flow and power.


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[rumatt]

He also didn't show performing the carb reset before the first cuts. I wonder if he had done it first, would the times have increased even without the muffler mod.

 

[drf256]

They have a bigger exhaust outlet stock than many of the older models did.

The only time I could see a muff mod not helping is in a saw with too much Blowdown. I really have no idea why it would hurt performance, unless it’s screwing with the MT system.

 

[00wyk]

The timing sounds rather time. I imagine an advance would make a bigger difference.

 

[460 magnum]

He also didn't show performing the carb reset before the first cuts. I wonder if he had done it first, would the times have increased even without the muffler mod.

I don't know if resetting the carb would do anything for it they adjust them self's after a few cuts. Redbull has videos about muffler modding the 661's and does not do a reset on the saw between mods.

 

[Nutball]

If the saw already comes with a large enough hole, the muffler mod might only affect the peak power rpm, but that is only helpful if the saw is being operated at that rpm with a chain optimized for that rpm.

 

[jackjcc]

Are we getting ahead of ourselves with the carb reset talk? Does that put it to a standard safe setting and the adjust after a few longer cuts or does it take in account the barometrics when you do a reset?


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[huskihl]

Are we getting ahead of ourselves with the carb reset talk? Does that put it to a standard safe setting and the adjust after a few longer cuts or does it take in account the barometrics when you do a reset?


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The 462 does a calibration, not a reset. It calibrates to the current conditions

 

[andyshine77]

I don't believe resetting the system is nessairy after a muffler mod, the system should adjust the mixture to compensate. All the reset does is take things back to factory settings, in the event you have a problem or replace a part in the system.

A lot of factors come into play here so to say something is or is not based on one test is hard for me to do, especially with all the variables. The 462 surly isn't as choked up as the previous couple generations of saws, so it will likely not gain as much. Some saws like the older 7900's didn't gain much from muffler mods.

 

[andyshine77]

The 462 does a calibration, not a reset. It calibrates to the current conditions

You beat me lol. I thought it was a reset however, like the older models?

 

[huskihl]

You beat me lol. I thought it was a reset however, like the older models?

Nope. It actually calibrates to your fuel, oil, temp, humidity, etc...

 

[andyshine77]

Nope. It actually calibrates to your fuel, oil, temp, humidity, etc...

That actually makes more sense than a reset. So the new system has a temp sensor? I don't believe the old units had one.

 

[huskihl]

That actually makes more sense than a reset. So the new system has a temp sensor? I don't believe the old units had one.

Not really sure. Seems like someone mentioned there being a heat sensor on the coil

 

[drf256]

I believe the system senses heat via plug resistance. Not so sure that V1 didn’t.

 

[DND 9000]

I don't believe resetting the system is nessairy after a muffler mod, the system should adjust the mixture to compensate.

It makes sense after porting or a muffler mod. Let the dealer do it with the software, because the base settings are changed there. The elevation has to be put in where the saw is mostly operated. That`s not the case if you do it without it. That means, a calibration run without the diagnostic tool and software is like tuning the carburetor with seated limiters. If you do it with the diagnostic tool at the dealer, it is "open" (like tuning the carb without limiter caps, full range availible, change of regulating limits = new baseline) Valid from V2.1 on.

So the new system has a temp sensor? I don't believe the old units had one.

That was also answered in the past many times. Every m-tronic system, no matter which version, has a temp sensor in the control unit. They need it to adjust properly.

 

[andyshine77]

It makes sense after porting or a muffler mod. Let the dealer do it with the software, because the base settings are changed there. The elevation has to be put in where the saw is mostly operated. That`s not the case if you do it without it. That means, a calibration run without the diagnostic tool and software is like tuning the carburetor with seated limiters. If you do it with the diagnostic tool at the dealer, it is "open" (like tuning the carb without limiter caps, full range availible, change of regulating limits = new baseline) Valid from V2.1 on.



That was also answered in the past many times. Every m-tronic system, no matter which version, has a temp sensor in the control unit. They need it to adjust properly.

Thanks for the information. However the system should be able to compensate without having to reset/calibrate the system or values for altitude IMHO. Is the limiting a Stihl thing or regulatory? If a Stihl thing that's aweful.

I'm a bit perplexed, I've been following the Mtronic system pretty closely, I was unaware the Mtronic had a temp sensor. My understanding was, the system simply hunts for a spisfic RPM under load to find the correct tune. Too lean rpm's drop, too rich rpm's drop, at least this is what was in the literature and what Stihl was saying with the early Mtronic. I liked this because it made the system simple and almost full proof, when you start adding sensors they're just going to fail eventually. If values are shown when hooked up, than obviously the system is picking up the temp somehow. We know the AutoTune system has always had a temp sensor and TPS which was much more advanced at the time, not that it seemed to help the 550 or 562 with all their issues, it was too complicated and husky couldn't ever get the fuel settings correct. The throttle cable would also stretch over time messing with the position of the hall effect sensor, causing idling and acceleration problems. Husky did too much too fast, Stihl seemed to take things slow at first.

[emoji111]

 

[DND 9000]

I don`t know exactly what Husqvarna does. Always remember, m-tronic has 2 ways to regulate:

1st change of ignition timing
2nd change of delivered fuel flow.

A change of the ignition timing has an imediate effect on the rpms, a change of the fuel supply values needs 200-300ms until it affects the running caracteristics. (because of the way from the carb, through the cranckcase, through the transfers into the cylinder.) First m-tronic regulates with the ignition timing and 2nd with the fuel flow. These 2 ways work together, so that in most cases the user dosen`t notice it.

 

[andyshine77]

I don`t know exactly what Husqvarna does. Always remember, m-tronic has 2 ways to regulate:

1st change of ignition timing
2nd change of delivered fuel flow.

A change of the ignition timing has an imediate effect on the rpms, a change of the fuel supply values needs 200-300ms until it affects the running caracteristics. (because of the way from the carb, through the cranckcase, through the transfers into the cylinder.) First m-tronic regulates with the ignition timing and 2nd with the fuel flow. These 2 ways work together, so that in most cases the user dosen`t notice it.

Nice and simple.[emoji111]

 

[00wyk]

Is it just me, or do both non and MM'd clips sound the same? A hole 5X larger should make considerably more noise - about twice as much or more.
In any case, the timing sounds tame. I would suspect a timing advance would better take advantage of a muffler mod.

Andy - you don't have to worry about temp sensors failing - the solenoids themselves fail often enough you can simply replace the temp sensor during what is now becoming required maintenance on these saws.

Now speaking of MTronic, I found it interesting that folks are starting to show how the saws perform just as well when you swap out the MT carb for a standard carb. Where's the advantage in MT there? More maintenance? More cost? Is it actually reducing carbon output? Where is it? It's like an even more costly version of a flippy cap.