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Case Compression, Let's Talk About It

Dieselshawn

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Two strokes love turbos. They can make insane amount of power from such a tiny displacement.

One guy made 1,000 horse out of a Arctic Cat Thundercat snowmobile. While it was short lived, (broken crank) it sure moved.
 

huskihl

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Two strokes love turbos. They can make insane amount of power from such a tiny displacement.

One guy made 1,000 horse out of a Arctic Cat Thundercat snowmobile. While it was short lived, (broken crank) it sure moved.
It probably lived as long as the stock ones did :stick:
 

Ketchup

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My .02$

We are thinking too much into this using the "new" design's.

Saws are built with a performance 3rd or 4th mindset.

1,Emissions, they dont pass they cant sell.
2, Durability, need to meet those emissions for 300 hours
3, Performance
4, Price

Possibly swap 3,4 around.

All the tight cases front transfers that we have seen, I feel are more to meet emissions than anything to do with power.

Same thing with the long stroke engines. Allows more time to control gas flow/mix.

Just like all the random "obstacles" in newer castings. Those odd lips in the transfers, sharp blocks in the corners. All to aim /distribute fresh/spent charge before hitting the sniffer.

Since "emissions " covers a broad range of things C02,N0X, raw fuel etc it is hard to tell what the focus is on.

Considering new saws like 462, 562xp, 881, I’d say the engineers managed to squeak some performance past the EPA and sales department. The designers care even if the office guys don’t.
 

Red97

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Considering new saws like 462, 562xp, 881, I’d say the engineers managed to squeak some performance past the EPA and sales department. The designers care even if the office guys don’t.

They are stout. But the "old" versions will make more power after both are modified.
 

Al Smith

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I don't know how to could turbo charge a port style two cycle engine .On a rotary valve you might be able to though . I would think it would act similar to a GMC Detroit diesel being more for scavenging than actual boost . Perhaps that is what the McCulloch BP-1 was trying to do ?
 

farminkarman

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I don't know how to could turbo charge a port style two cycle engine .On a rotary valve you might be able to though . I would think it would act similar to a GMC Detroit diesel being more for scavenging than actual boost . Perhaps that is what the McCulloch BP-1 was trying to do ?
You can successfully turbo a piston ported two-stroke, but the gains really start to show up with case-reed induction. The turbocharged 2-stroke snowmobiles really shine up in the mountains where you can maintain full power all the way up to the top.
 

farminkarman

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I should add that any turbocharged two stroke I have seen still has an expansion pipe between the cylinder and turbo. I would think the pipe is crucial for back-stuffing the extra charge back into the cylinder.
 

Al Smith

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If it takes a back stuffer pipe then any forced induction would act like a scavenging blower .What it should do though is purge the unburned products of combustion from the cylinder which should be an improvement .It's all in theory only .You wouldn't really know unless you did it though .
 

ManiacalMark

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Two strokes love turbos. They can make insane amount of power from such a tiny displacement.

One guy made 1,000 horse out of a Arctic Cat Thundercat snowmobile. While it was short lived, (broken crank) it sure moved.

Billet crank would fix that….until the next part breaks.
 

ManiacalMark

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I don't know how to could turbo charge a port style two cycle engine .On a rotary valve you might be able to though . I would think it would act similar to a GMC Detroit diesel being more for scavenging than actual boost . Perhaps that is what the McCulloch BP-1 was trying to do ?

But those two are two different types of 2 stroke scavenging. Detroits have exhaust valves which makes them uniflow.
 

Wanab

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What kind of duration numbers do folks like to see when it comes to case pressure?
 

Ketchup

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o_O
What kind of duration numbers do folks like to see when it comes to case pressure?

Depends on size of engine and port shape. Wider ports need less duration.

For 90cc saws I like Intake in the 158-164 area, Exhaust around 156-160, Transfers somewhere near 112-120.

On the other end. For 25cc I like less intake (136-142), less exhaust (144-150) and similar transfer (110-116).

Some of the new Stratos have strange transfer durations and it’s important to note the cold air duration vs fuel mix duration on the intake side. The fresh air may open at the port at very different time than it feeds the transfers. For example I just timed a 550mk2 at fuel mix duration 148, Fresh air at intake 154, piston to transfer 140. o_O
Figuring out what I want with those is specific to my changes and the individual model. Mostly I just leave them alone.

I feel Intake duration is the most significant for case pressure. Width doesn’t matter as much as timing because the real issue is piston position when the intake closes. The earlier the case is filled and the intake closes, the better. I like short intake duration and a wide port.

Transfer height effects pressure, but will still move nearly the same volume, maybe more at longer durations as rpms increase. In general, longer transfer durations seem beneficial regardless of effect on case pressure.

For exhaust a low roof (shorter duration) adds force to the down stroke and add a slight bump in pressure right before the transfers crack. That translates to higher transfer velocity, improved scavenging, and saw with some extra torque. I like shorter exhaust durations with very wide ports. But if there is too little duration the saw will just be a slow grinder. I try to set my exhaust at a happy balance. Usually with slightly more duration than stock.

Every model has its peculiarities. I probably go against my own habits 30% of the time.





Not sure why I wrote all that. I get carried away sometimes.
 
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