pico vs .325 vs 3/8 for residential light duty

[r7000]

been chain sawing a bit last couple weeks.
I think I've always used a 3/8-pico chain, on my saw or whatever I've used over the years.

Used an 029 having a .325 chain and after being conscious about the cutting abilities between saws I was using, I like a .325 over the pico.

So my question(s) are

1. I have a poulan pro (i.e. wild thing) 18" ~40cc saw, given to me, I've put $100 into over the years getting it 100% and it works well, and I've had a handful of chains for it so it serves it's purpose when I need it. Does anyone know if an 18" bar, and drum sprocket, is available for it to run a .325 chain?
2. If I decide to splurge and get a new saw, when the poulan pisses me off for the last time and I throw it, it'll either be a stihl or husqv saw. Are the only chain sizes basically the 3/8-pico, .325, and 3/8 (.375) ? so question here is a full size 3/8 chain better than a .325 or no? Under what cutting conditions? I'd definitely want an 18" bar, not smaller, as that's what I'm used to, could maybe be ok with 20". But I don't expect to be doing more than residental work and nothing large, mostly limb cutting, occassional 12" to 20" diameter.

 

[davidwyby]

Smooth, fast cutting is stihl 23rs. Narrow kerf (cut width) .325. More cutters closer together than low pro. I think RM would be semi chisel which wouldn't cut as fast, but be more durable. as you go up the tree, you can get by with less durability, and vice versa.

3/8" might be more grabby and whip branches at you. Also more load on the saw...unless you have the powa! -better for bigger wood.

If you get another saw, and upgrade is to get one with a metal crankcase (bottom end) vs. plastic.

 

[r7000]

so i'm kinda leaning towards a husqv 455 with 20" bar, or maybe the 445 with 18" bar.

my big question, not sure how to word, chain dimensions for cutting... what would be the best?

reading things like narrow kerf and half skip and all that other stuff, let's say make/model saw not part of the equation it is 100% good...

to get a great cutting saw, with either the 18" or 20" bar, what chain would I buy separately? Or buy a replacement bar to allow for such a chain, assuming there is a better chain that exists than the one that comes on the 455 20" saw which is 3/8" ? ( The 445 18" has a .325 chain)

I would be interested in that lightweight mika-whatever bar advertised on here, which they have for the husqv saws.

So thinking the bigger 455 saw with 20" bar, that i could have the flexibility to swap bars and or chains on between 20" and 18" and 3/8 and .325 chain? Is a sprocket available for the 455 to switch between 3/8 and .325 chain? Trying to understand all the possibilities before I spend $500+ on a new saw and accessories... is there a buychainsawchains.com where I can peruse all kinda chains available? thanks.

 

[Philbert]

There are lots of options for chains:

Pitch - .325" is slightly smaller than 3/8 (technically .365"), so it takes more, smaller bites of the wood. This makes it smoother in smaller diameter wood.

Low Profile - 3/8 is available in low-profile versions (STIHL calls theirs 'Picco') which also take smaller bites of the wood, and let’s lower powered saws keep their revs up.

Narrow Kerf - narrow kerf chain takes thinner bites of the wood, and makes lower power saws cut like more powerful saws. There is narrow-kerf .325 chain, and now, narrow kerf AND low profile .325 (Oregon 'Nano') and 3/8 chain (Oregon Type 90, and others): this is being supplied on some of the newer battery powered saws.

Manufacturers generally choose what they think the best performing combination of drive sprocket, chain, and bar is for a saw. Users are free to change these. Just understand that the 'standard' parts will usually be easier to find down the road. 3/8 low profile, .325, and .325 narrow kerf chains are widely available.

I run .325 narrow kerf chain on a Husqvarna 353, which could pull standard .325. But that's what came with the saw, and I am really happy with the performance. I would be reluctant to put a low profile chain on that saw, because it is capable of running the larger format, and I would not be using the full potential of the saw.

Philbert

 

[BlackGreyhound]

Looks like the 455 Rancher comes with 3/8 sprocket, so I'd just stick with that, especially if you are planning on using a 20 bar. Yes, you can swap out sprockets, and bars, etc., but that takes time and $. It's very easy to fall down a very expensive rabbit hole farting around with bars/chains/sprockets. Trust me, I know.

 

[Philbert]

I should also mention that the lower profile and narrow kerf chains were designed for lower power saws and use lighter components ( tie straps, rivets, etc.) which can break on larger, higher powered saws. The Oregon catalog lists maximum recommended displacement and bar length for each chain they sell.

Philbert

 

[davidwyby]

I'd run 20" 3/8" on the 455 and be done.

That being said I like to fool around and experiment and the 23rs is fast....the 455 should be able to be set up for it.

 

[ElevatorGuy]

I thought the husky 455 would pull a 36!? ZP said so!

 

[davidwyby]

I thought the husky 455 would pull a 36!? ZP said so!

36" of skip low pro safety chain.

 

[Int1968]

Another one for consideration is the .325 nano Oregon?, think it’s .43 gauge designed for electronic saws and top handle climbing. Really depends what your using the saw for when deciding what to use.

Just picked up a 281 that the previous owner set up with a 20” bar .404 58gauge safety chain/split rakers, so you never know.

 

[davidwyby]

I’d skip the .043”. Stick to 0hfiddy.


@Int1968

@Philbert

 

[Lsf]

Stihl 3/8LP , 0.43 "mini" picco vs 0.50" chains side by side. The MS 170 owner was satisfied, stays sharp and last longer.
.050" 3/8LP chains are cheaper chains here, Oregon / Stihl.

 

[davidwyby]

NOTE: .050" is the driver width, not the kerf width. Kerf is the width of cut. Generally though, the .043" will be NK.

 

[projanen]

Is 1/4" pitch even smoother than 0.325? What are the downside of the smaller pitches (on smaller saws)?

For the narrow, low-profile bars, why not go all the way to 1/4" pitch?

I'm planning to put Stihl chains on my battery saws this month, all 0.043 drivers and low-profile: primarily T540i XP, also M18 pole saw, and M18 rear-handle saw.
(I will keep 3/8" 0.050 on a 500i for heavier ground work, and I hope to get a 201T (3/8" 0.050) later this year for heavier work in the tree.)

 

[Philbert]

1/4” takes tiny bites, and the teeth are so small that they disappear after a few filings.


Philbert

 

[davidwyby]

I hear 1/4" is an improvement on small cc saws such as the 2511. I gotta try it.

 

[projanen]

1/4” takes tiny bites, and the teeth are so small that they disappear after a few filings.


Philbert

When is 1/4" (.043) appropriate?

Pruning?
Low power saws? Below 30cc, 40cc?

YouTube (MonkeyBeaver, Panther) tells me 1/4" .043 may be helpful/faster/smoother for cutting limbs (vertical, pruning type cuts). But it is not appropriate for chunking a vertical spar (horizontal, felling type cuts).

I understand from Philbert that the overall smaller chain would have less longevity, certainly in total use. Perhaps it also needs to be sharpened more often. These are the downsides to possibly gaining efficiency while in the tree.

Could I expect gains in a saw/bar dedicated to trimming?

I could swap bars after the limbs are down. Or swap saws, which I see people doing when transitioning from limbs to trunk work.

(I'm new, climbing for two years, well-trained: one week each year with ACRT, low experience. Transitioning from neighborly work to volunteer work and now beginning to take paid gigs, as a second job on Saturdays and summertime evenings.)

 

[Int1968]

1/4” is difficult to sharpen properly. Probably not durable enough in your area.

Remember monkey beaver is on the west coast dealing with different trees. Even he admits you’ll run out of chain tooth to sharpen with the panther bars before the chain is done.


I’d look for an in between saw for climbing work, 50-60cc and leave the 540i alone.

they bought us m18 saws at work for a stop gap when fires were raging here in northwest Ontario last year. Waste of 800$ sorry, awkward using (the design is an afterthought) and chain derailment and durability problems problems. I would not want to use 1/4” for hardwood, dead trees. It’s only place I feel is doing light pruning of live trees for production, or on a gas pole saw. Our hydraulic pole saws at work are setup with standard.325

Pole saws are a mostly low use item and I wouldn’t switch those other saws over just for chain chassis commonality

Go work or hangout with some local tree guys and see what works and why, for what grows in your area and the type of work your going to be doing

 

[Philbert]

When is 1/4" (.043) appropriate?
Pruning?
Low power saws? Below 30cc, 40cc?

Some battery-powered saws and some pole saws.

I have used 3/8 low profile / narrow kerf chains, (Oregon Type 90) and Orego ‘Nano’ .325 low profile / narrow kerf chains on both of these types of saws and like them better.



Oh yeah, and for carving!


Philbert

 

[isaaccarlson]

That "chip sweeper" mod with the safety chain is slick. I have always removed the humps completely, but it sure looks faster with the chips getting cleared and not under the rakers. Thumbs up.