Pferd 2 in 1 File System

[RI Chevy]

I recently purchased Two of the Pferd 2 in 1 chain file systems from Bailey's. They seemed like a good deal, so I pulled the trigger and got them. I got one in .325 and one in 3/8. About $34.99 each plus shipping.

I had a couple of new Carlton Full Chisel Chains that I had only used for a few cuts, and I was curious to see how these files worked. I was also curious to see if my rakers were high on a new chain. Keep in mind that these chains cut really well, and did not have one stroke done to them to touch up or sharpen them. They were new out of the box chains. So I decided to sharpen these chains. One in .325 Full Chisel and one in 3/8 Full Chisel with this new sharpener.

The sharpener actually was very easy to use and sharpened very well. I did both chains. When I went to use the saws after I used this 2 in 1 filing system, the chains were extremely grabby. Almost to the point that the saws would bog down and stop in the cut. I found out the hard way when I was felling a tree in one of my videos. I knew the rakers were to low.

So needless to say, I wasn't impressed at all with this Pferd 2 in 1 filing system. This is the same as the Stihl 2 in 1 file that is sold by Stihl in orange instead of blue.

In chatting with a few other members, primarily @dall, he also observed the same issue, as he had just recently purchased the Stihl version. We both came up to the same conclusion that the saw chains were too grabby in the wood after sharpening with this new file setup. It took the rakers a little to low while sharpening.

After I used the saws with the chains, I went back, old school, and took a few strokes off of the cutters to see if the chains would get any better. They are slowly coming back and cutting better, with each time I sharpen them with just a file and a simple guide to the teeth. Not sure if I should keep using this, or if I will run into the same issues.

In the past, I used to sharpen the teeth with a basic file guide, and as I noticed the chain not cutting as well, I would take a stroke off each raker as needed. The chain would naturally then cut a little better, and I would repeat this process throughout the life of the chain.

Any thoughts? Anyone here use this Pferd/Stihl 2 in 1 file system? Am I doing something wrong?
I know, I need to learn how to square file. LOL

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

[RI Chevy]

I should state, that when using the 2 in 1 file for 3/8 chain, that the guide seems to be defaulted toward 25 degree filing angles. I checked and somewhere, I found that 3/8 chain should be filed at 30 degree angles. I also noticed that the witness marks showed that I sharpened at the wrong angle, based on this 2 in1 file system.
As I filed the teeth by hand using the basic file guide, I used the 30 degree angle and 30 seems to be better and right in line with the witness marks. I have since brought the teeth back to 30 degrees and the chain cuts much better.

The .325 2 in1 file is defaulted to 25 degrees, which matches what my hand file shows as well as the witness marks on the chain. The .325 chain was not as bad as the 3/8 chain when cutting, but was still noticeably grabby when cutting after using the 2 in1 file.

Am I correct in my angles? 3/8" chain using 30 degree filing angles? And .325 using 25 degree filing angles?

 

[Dub11]

I have only used mine on .325 on Stihl green chain and it really woke those chains up haven't used it yet on the one full chisel loop I have. And the one Carlton full chisel chain I got it called for a smaller file 11/32 I think would the 3/16 file be that much different? And sorry if I got those numbers wrong.

 

[RI Chevy]

Not sure on the file sizes. I just went by the chain size when I ordered.

I would imagine that when you used the 2 in1 file on a green tag chain, that it really woke it up. Did you notice the chain grab and bog the saw at all? I bet you could see the rakers with a flat spot on them from the file.

 

[Magic_Man]

I should state, that when using the 2 in 1 file for 3/8 chain, that the guide seems to be defaulted toward 25 degree filing angles. I checked and somewhere, I found that 3/8 chain should be filed at 30 degree angles. I also noticed that the witness marks showed that I sharpened at the wrong angle, based on this 2 in1 file system.
As I filed the teeth by hand using the basic file guide, I used the 30 degree angle and 30 seems to be better and right in line with the witness marks. I have since brought the teeth back to 30 degrees and the chain cuts much better.

The .325 2 in1 file is defaulted to 25 degrees, which matches what my hand file shows as well as the witness marks on the chain. The .325 chain was not as bad as the 3/8 chain when cutting, but was still noticeably grabby when cutting after using the 2 in1 file.

Am I correct in my angles? 3/8" chain using 30 degree filing angles? And .325 using 25 degree filing angles?

Angle depends on the chain, some 3/8 chisel chain calls for 25 degrees factory but really it's a personal preference. Old rule of thumb was the more angle you used the sharper the chain but less wear resistance. Messing around the other day I filed some chisel chain at 35 degrees and it was some sharp nasty stuff but didn't last long at all. So I backed my angles down to 25 degrees keeping all else the same and the chain seems to last longer now but I don't notice much difference in speed of cut in hardwood.

 

[RI Chevy]

Wow. OK. So there is no standard for angles? Each brand of chain has its own sharpening angle? A little confusing to me. I only used Stihl and Oregon for many years, only just recently buying some Carlton full chisel based on its great reputation from some members here.

 

[Dub11]

Not sure on the file sizes. I just went by the chain size when I ordered.

I would imagine that when you used the 2 in1 file on a green tag chain, that it really woke it up. Did you notice the chain grab and bog the saw at all? I bet you could see the rakers with a flat spot on them from the file.

Didn't grab but cut alot fast and yes you could see a flat spot.

Now when you are using your do you take it straight across or kind of at an upward angle going from inside out?

 

[Dub11]

I just bought some Carlton chain two because the shop had buy 2 loops 3rds free. Kinda was disappointed in the full chisel I think I need to file it before using it again

 

[Dub11]

now the semi chisel 3/8 low pro I got kicked ass bit that was on my Poulan pro 35cc 16"

 

[RI Chevy]

I try to file at the 25 degree angle with a slight angle up. With .325 chain. Don't give up on the Carlton full chisel .325 chain. It holds an edge very well, and really cuts. Maybe try and touch it up with just a round file on the teeth and not the 2 in 1 file. See if that helps.

 

[Dub11]

Oh I will I only used for like 10 cuts one time on clean wood then put the green chain on I cut a lot of crap and brush for people not much big wood. Plus the ms 290 is kinda over kill for what I do. Until I found this site I thought it was the baddest saw ever and its still the biggest saw I have ever ran for now.

 

[Dub11]

And I wont be giving up on Carlton any time soon I mean 3 loops out the door 35 bucks 1 loop at the stihlership is 25 and the guys at this shop remember what I run and who Iam cant beat that

 

[RI Chevy]

Lol. I ran an 029 for over 20 years. My only saw until the past couple of years since I was over at the other place and then here. Lol
029 never, ever let me down. Good saw for sure.

Carlton is good stuff. So is Stihl, but your right, for the price you can't beat it.

 

[jakethesnake]

Carlton needs to be touched with a file to cut fast. I like how well it keeps an edge. In all reality file size makes little difference if you know what you're trying to achieve I free hand my stuff I've used the "wrong" file many times and still had a chain that cut I've never tryed this sharpener mentioned but would guess if you chane the way you hold it you may be able to have it come out less aggressive

 

[jakethesnake]

As a note I don't run my chains near as aggressive as some simply because they dull up fast

 

[jakethesnake]

That's about what I shot for it don't fast as some but very durable and smooth

 

[RI Chevy]

What it did was take the rakers down a little to far. Just in case you are not familiar with it, it files the tooth and the raker at the same time. Its like a jig. I am not sure that the raker file is set up in the jig correctly though. At least not to my liking.
I also free hand sharpen some times as well using the witness marks as a guide.

 

[RI Chevy]

View attachment 42420 That's about what I shot for it don't fast as some but very durable and smooth

Nice!

 

[RI Chevy]

I took this yesterday after a quick touch up. I didn't clean the tooth up for the pic. Just a quick shot for reference.

 

[jakethesnake]

Kinda chain is that ri