Started Asian 440 BB #4 Today

[Wonkydonkey]

Thanks for the update, I’m liking to the bb 440's

 

[00wyk]

Well, she is running, but not before scaring me!

First, it took 12 pulls to get her to kick, seemed like a lot. Then she seemed to be running fine, did 5 nice cuts, then she dies.

I check the plug connection, then I'm worried that the flywheel spun, so I prime it and she kicks. Even though I had a DDave carb on it, based on past problems I change the carb … no help.

Prime it again, she kicks. So I change the fuel filter and we are good to go!

Saw feels good, but I've been running the 066 so much lately I may be expecting too much from her! We will let her break in a bit and see how she does, but she does not run bad! Very responsive to the throttle.

Gotta run, my Step Son's Birthday today!

Thanks for taking us on the ride. Looks sweet. I know how ya feel about the 66 vs the 44. I would occasionally spend days with my (mildly ported) 288xp on 99 drivers, buried in oak. Then have to grab the 044 on 84dl to do some felling, and the moment I put it in wood I'm thinking 'WTF is wrong with this saw?!'. And it's a fairly healthy 10mm 044.

 

[drf256]

No replacement for displacement.

 

[MustangMike]

These darn Asian saws, was running it today, and it crapped on me - again! Opened the fuel tank and re started it, and it was fine, so I replaced the tank vent.

Also, replaced the DP cover I opened up with a stock one. It was sucking down fuel like crazy. Seems to run at least as strong with the stock DP cover, so I think I did the right thing.

Hopefully it is all good now, seems to be running well, but time will tell. I hate it when a saw is not reliable! That is why I like to use them for a while before I move them along.

 

[Duke Thieroff]

I remember years ago there was some talk about a lot of the Chinese BB066s kits being no good, if I recall it was because they would regularly free port. Is that still the case?

Those New West kits are legit!

 

[Nutball]

I got a few of the cheapest BB660 kits I could find to practice porting on, and I quickly noticed a huge gap under the piston if pushed to the top of the cylinder. I assumed the squish band would have to be huge to prevent free porting, so it's made me wonder. Could I rough up the bottom edge of the exhaust port and add JB weld and shape it to raise the bottom, or would heat and or heat expansion burn it out or knock it loose?

 

[Duke Thieroff]

I got a few of the cheapest BB660 kits I could find to practice porting on, and I quickly noticed a huge gap under the piston if pushed to the top of the cylinder. I assumed the squish band would have to be huge to prevent free porting, so it's made me wonder. Could I rough up the bottom edge of the exhaust port and add JB weld and shape it to raise the bottom, or would heat and or heat expansion burn it out or knock it loose?

View attachment 157749

Just stack up a few base gaskets, problem solved!!!!

 

[Nutball]

Just stack up a few base gaskets, problem solved!!!!

Good excuse to run nitro. What about welding a popup disk on? I guess that'd be kinda heavy.

The top of the piston should still be around 2mm from the bottom of the exhaust port at BDC according to my measurements. I haven't seen one on a saw though.

 

[MustangMike]

The info I have seen is the free porting was on the BB 660 kits, but I have not used the Huztl P+C that come with any of the kits.

From what I understand, the BB 660 piston will not fit into the case, so they resolved this by shortening the piston, hence the Free Bore.

On the 440 BB kits, the piston does fit into the case, so it is not a problem.

 

[MG porting]

I did the porting on my outdoor workbench (I C clamp the cylinder to my trailer). It was actually nice (very briefly) in the early afternoon. Colder this morning, then got windy and colder again in the late afternoon.

This cylinder needed lots of work. My work is not as pretty as some, but it will run a lot better than it was! Did not want to move the exhaust much, but was hard to fix the problems and not move it a bit. The intake came out right about where I wanted it.

Final #s are Ex 95, Tr 118 and In 78. I think those #s should be good. Increasing the width of the exhaust, moving the upper transfers toward the intake (and the small bridge ports), and lowering the intake should make a nice difference in how this thing runs over how it would have run unmolested. Maybe tomorrow we will get to fire it up!

Good job I like those numbers to she should run very strong

 

[Wood Chopper]

The one Huztl BB 660 I built with the base gasket did not free port. Tried deleting the gasket and had some free porting then. Must have got lucky. Now that I am slowly adding to my collection of oem saws I want to go back in to the 660 with cross top end and BB 660 to check things out and stick a oem wrist pin bearing in. Also mine as well make my Asian 440 a BB.

 

[MustangMike]

Ran the saw again today and it seems all is good now … rewarding to finally get it right when you have encountered numerous problems!

I sharpened the chain and she cut real well. Does not have the torque the 066 has, but I guess if it did it would mean I did a piss poor job on the 066!

I really like that she is well mannered. Idles smooth, and if it is warm, even if I let it sit for a good while, I can just press the decomp, put her on run, and she starts right up. I really like that in a saw cause I often shut it down to mover a few rounds with the peavey, then re start it.

The heavier piston seems to produce a few more vibes at idle, but when you pull the trigger it seems to smooth right out, so I'm good with it.

 

[MustangMike]

I really like the weight of the 440s (compared with 460s, 461s and especially 660s), and she seems to balance perfectly with a 24" B+C.

They look so nice when they are new!

 

[MG porting]

Ran the saw again today and it seems all it good now … rewarding to finally get it right when you have encountered numerous problems!

I sharpened the chain and she cut real well. Does not have the torque the 066 has, but I guess if it did it would mean I did a piss poor job on the 066!

I really like that she is well mannered. Idles smooth, and if it is warm, even if I let it sit for a good while, I can just press the decomp, put her on run, and she starts right up. I really like that in a saw cause I often shut it down to mover a few rounds with the peavey, then re start it.

The heavier piston seems to produce a few more vibes at idle, but when you pull the trigger it seems to smooth right out, so I'm good with it.

Nice.

 

[MustangMike]

Even when it stops raining it is so wet around here I just start some indoor projects. Compared the 3 remaining New West BB jugs I have, and all 3 look remarkably similar. Based on my measurements, port timing should be nearly identical (I purchased 2 direct, and got a 3rd from Dr Al, but all look close to the same).

Based on my previous experience with them, I'm going to guess the Ex will be in the high 90s, Transfers in the high one teens, and Intake way too high in the low 60s. So, to get these jugs to run well, Ex needs to be widened and straightened out, intake needs to be dropped (a lot) and upper transfers need to be moved further toward the intake. Numbers will be OK, but not perfect.

So, I compared this to one of the HLS 460 jugs I have (previous Door Buster). The one Dr Al gave me is unwrapped, so I used that one. The Exhaust, Transfer and Intake are all lower, and based on one I timed on a 460 I think it is close to that: 103, 124, 72.

On the HLS jug the Ex is wide enough, but could be a little flatter, the Upper Transfers are not flat (it is higher on the intake side), but otherwise look fantastic, and the intake needs to be lowered (good thing, because it is not even flat). Put a piston in to check, and it opens first on rt + left, then in the middle!

The previous HLS jug I made into a Hybrid just has the intake lowered and some bridge ports, and it runs very well. I'm thinking if I flatten out the exhaust a bit (it has a lot of arch), and also level the upper transfers, it may be really strong! Also, on the outside of the Ex port, the height is fine but the width looks kinda narrow. I can fix that!

Wasn't planning this, but I just can't seem to leave them alone!!! They just call me!!!

 

[MustangMike]

Checked the port timing on the 3 New West BB cylinders I have not used yet, and got the following:

Cyl A - Sq .015, Ex 100, Tr 120, In 66

Cyl B - Sq .015, Ex 102.5, Tr 121, Ex 67

Cyl C - Sq .018 Ex 100, Tr 120, In 66

On all 3 I will lower the intake to about 78 (5/8" from bottom), and try not to change port timing with my other work.

I think they all look good, but maybe B is the best?

 

[MustangMike]

For anyone who missed them when they were the "Door Buster", HL Supply has these as the daily deal today.

I'm running one on a 460 with Meteor piston and one on a Hybrid with OEM piston, both run very well. The porting on these jugs is great, just need some clean up, and I've not had any problems with the plating.

They are also easier to modify for a Hybrid than OEM. Just slot the holes, thin the sides of the base a bit, and a very slight mod to the fins on the front left to clear the bulge in the top cover for the plug wire.

The jug I put on the 460 (w/o base gasket) was sq .025, Ex 103, Tr 124 and In 72. I moved the In to 80. Most importantly, the transfers are beautiful on these things, although I added bridge ports to the Hybrid, and it seems to like it.

I always like a great deal!

https://www.hlsproparts.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=H30046

 

[MustangMike]

Well, Big Bore #4 runs good, but I did not think it was quite as strong as #2 (the one that went to my friend Harold's son). That one just seemed to have more torque.

So after checking the port timing on my 3 remaining BB cylinders, I choose to make cylinder B Big Bore #5. I did the port work to it over the last few days.

I did not want another running saw in the garage (currently have 20, and the wife is starting to catch on that they are not all in for repair), so I took the OEM 044 P+C off the Asian base and converted that to BB #5. That straight fin 044 jug did not run nearly as strong as my 10mm 044, or as strong as the 440 I had (w/base gasket delete).

Well, BB #5 came to life today, and right before dark she even got to cut some wood. I'm pleased, this saw feels good! Noodled some Red Oak and Black Oak, and you could lean on it and it kept pulling. Considering these are the first cuts, and it is not broken in at all, I'm very pleased.

 

[MustangMike]

Now I have some great running saws done by Randy, Dr Al and CFB … but I did this one all by myself, and it is all Asian except the piston pin bearing and recoil rope! I gotta tell ya, I'm a little giddy about it … guess my Nephew is right … says I'm like a 66 year old Teenager!

I think I'm finally starting to get my porting technique down! About time!

 

[MustangMike]

When I checked the timing of this jug on an Asian case I threw together I got Sq .015, Ex 102.5, Tr 121 and In 67. I lowered the intake to about 78 and left the other ports where they were, but widened and flattened (not completely flat) the Ex, and improved the upper transfers (moved them closer to the intake) and added small bridge ports in the process.

When I installed the same P+C on the other case, squish was now .020 … so these darn Asian cases are not all exactly the same (guess I should not be surprised). So I figure the timing #s are about 1/2 degree different than what I measured, on this case (close enough for Government work).

So I'm guessing about 102, 120.5 and 78 for #s. IMO, good #s and a good runner!

Hey, as long as it runs well, that is all I care about! She popped on the 4th pull, cleared the assembly oil smoke about 20 seconds later, and was very close to all tuned in. I'll take it!