Inside the MS462C

[sawmikaze]

OK. Cool.
See if he has any Team Stihl sh!t. LMAO

Jeff if you saw the stihl gloves/hats/clocks and all kinds of other *s-word I've been given you would probably bust your stones.

Since your buddy Mikey feels like you don't work on saws if you don't take pictures and put them on OPE I'll take a picture of the 460 I'm gonna rebuild tomorrow with a little light port work and some machining from T4.

 

[andyshine77]

Research how it meets emissions.

I understand fully how these saws work. Sorry you're off base on this one.

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[MustangMike]

I'm not a saw mechanic..and neither are you.

Never claimed to be. But, at least I sometimes post pics of the more interesting things I've worked on.

And I'll bet I fix 10x the chainsaws you do.

Pics, or it didn't happen! Besides, I have never seen you post any advice on repairing a saw, ever. At least I put stuff out there now and then. And if someone more experienced than me like Brad disagrees with me, that is fine, it contributes to the collective knowledge of the site.

 

[andyshine77]

The 461 has a lot of parts in common with a 460, but they are very different saws. Here is a quote:

"This powerful professional chain saw is the successor to the MS 460 and is ideal for users in the forestry, agricultural and arborist markets. It features a low emission stratified charge engine with delayed stratified scavenging"

That is very different than a 460, and will generate more heat.

Don't get me wrong, I think the 461 is a VG saw, I just would not choose to leave it stock ... then again, I don't leave anything stock!

The 461 is not a Strato design in any way! That is just a marketing term used buy Stihl.

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[mdavlee]

The 461 is not a Strato design in any way! That is just a marketing term used buy Stihl.

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All they did is put the transfer entry on the clutch side so it has a longer path to get to the chamber.

 

[MustangMike]

I understand fully how these saws work. Sorry you're off base on this one.

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How so? A stratified charge, and delayed stratified scavenging don't make more heat?

Doesn't "delayed stratified scavenging" mean it tries to stuff some of the exhaust back into the transfer before the next cycle? Seems like it would create more heat to me. Please tell me where I'm wrong here.

 

[nohoff]

If you think this little bridge wont cool the piston i give you the free oppotunity to remove this part.
Better power/weight ratio...

If i would take a picture of every saw i repair, i should get a own picture thread.
I think about 20-25 Stihl machines a day.

Team STIHL approves!

 

[MustangMike]

It is light as a feather, but I'm sure it is there for a reason!

 

[nohoff]

Send them to me.
I ll pay shipping and please send pics of some wrecked pistons later

Bridge + 2 screws are about 35 grams.

 

[sawmikaze]

Never claimed to be. But, at least I sometimes post pics of the more interesting things I've worked on.



Pics, or it didn't happen! Besides, I have never seen you post any advice on repairing a saw, ever. At least I put stuff out there now and then. And if someone more experienced than me like Brad disagrees with me, that is fine, it contributes to the collective knowledge of the site.

Mike I don't have time for that *s-word.

I don't need to post any advice, it's usually covered by the time I land...and the guys who know a lot more than I do on the wrench end have it taken care of.

You still didn't answer my original question.

 

[andyshine77]

How so? A stratified charge, and delayed stratified scavenging don't make more heat?

Doesn't "delayed stratified scavenging" mean it tries to stuff some of the exhaust back into the transfer before the next cycle? Seems like it would create more heat to me. Please tell me where I'm wrong here.

Delaying the charge it totally different than scavenge. The 461, and 661 mostly just have better volumetric efficiency.

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[MustangMike]

You mean the purpose of the bridge? I had answered it. Randy stated the he was told it deflects the fuel to cool the piston. Must of been a reason they decided to do that, don't ya think?

 

[nohoff]

Those technical informations state the upper transfers open before the exhaust opens.
So its a cmobination of longer transfer channel and some other timings.
Can anyone confirm that?
I dont have a MS 461/661 here right now.

 

[sawmikaze]

You mean the purpose of the bridge? I had answered it. Randy stated the he was told it deflects the fuel to cool the piston. Must of been a reason they decided to do that, don't ya think?

I'm honestly not sure, it's not my area of expertise.

The reason apparently remains to be seen.

 

[andyshine77]

Those technical informations state the upper transfers open before the exhaust opens.
So its a cmobination of longer transfer channel and some other timings.
Can anyone confirm that?
I dont have a MS 461/661 here right now.

The 461 does not have Strato ports.

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[paragonbuilder]

Those technical informations state the upper transfers open before the exhaust opens.
So its a cmobination of longer transfer channel and some other timings.
Can anyone confirm that?
I dont have a MS 461/661 here right now.

Can you show us this technical bulletin?

 

[nohoff]

It doesnt need strato ports.
It puts exhaust gases in the transfers to get the same effect.
I only have the german Technical Informations here.
Its TI 16.2012 Release of the MS 461



I translate the text below.
The piston (1) moves downward. It open exhaust channel (2) first and then transfer channel (3). While opening the transfer channel (3) the pressure in the chamber (4) is higher as the pressure in the transfers (3) and the crankcase (5).

 

[MustangMike]

It doesnt need strato ports.
It puts exhaust gases in the transfers to get the same effect.
I only have the german Technical Informations here.
Its TI 16.2012 Release of the MS 461

View attachment 104124

Exactly! I can confirm a 461 has long transfer ports.

 

[nohoff]

Thinking about the text in this TI i would say a tighter case would increase the pressure in case and transfers and will lead to less exhaust gases in the transfers.
I dont think the EPA likes this.
Or maybe Stihl is the new Volkswagen and all this 1 in 4 Channel thing is fake?

Team Stihl approves this!

For the girls here.

 

[andyshine77]

It doesnt need strato ports.
It puts exhaust gases in the transfers to get the same effect.
I only have the german Technical Informations here.
Its TI 16.2012 Release of the MS 461

View attachment 104124

I translate the text below.
The piston (1) moves downward. It open exhaust channel (2) first and then transfer channel (3). While opening the transfer channel (3) the pressure in the chamber (4) is higher as the pressure in the transfers (3) and the crankcase (5).

So what's different? I don't see anything, maybe a little more or less blow down. The 461 really has nothing special going on! It is however a simple and effective way to improve volumetric efficiency.

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