Asian 660 Controls

[MustangMike]

I recently fixed a customers 066 Round Top that had a leaking fuel tank with an Asian 660 fuel tank. However, I had to swap the control lever, trigger, trigger lock and spring to make it function like OEM.

So I know I'm going to be doing some tinkering with my Asian 660s to fix two common problems:

1) The saw will often not come off choke unless you depress the trigger, and they are difficult to get to stop in the Fast Idle position.

2) Even when you do get them to stop in the fast idle position, there is no fast idle.

I imagine I'll be pulling one of my 066s apart to compare the parts to the Asian 660s, but if anyone else has already done this and identified the problems, or knows how to resolve these problems, please share.

Thanks!!!

 

[BuckthornBonnie]

Walt (weimedog, afleetcommand) has mentioned ‘em a few times on his vids.

I’ve replaced some parts to get the choke right. Got another to do this winter as well.

 

[MustangMike]

Did he mention a solution? I figure I can always add some material with PL Premium, like I do on some of the 440 choke levers.

 

[cus_deluxe]

I bet it has more to do with crappy plastic flexing more than oem. Mine acts the same way, kind of hard to even get it down to choke position, gotta be careful you do t go right past “high idle” postition on the way back by. It works ok but not near as well as oem.

 

[RedGas]

http://opeforum.com/threads/660-fast-idle-solution-hooray.11450/

ETA: I guess you posted in that thread Mike, so maybe this isn't the info you're looking for...I tried, anyway...

 

[MustangMike]

You know, I did remember that, but that was for fixing a worn OEM control lever … but … hey, maybe it will work for the AM stuff.

THANKS, I'll give it a try, I did not put 2 + 2 together!!!

 

[RedGas]

My bad...I had heard about the funky Asian throttle setups and read that post as a fix for them, rather than a fix for a worn OEM.

I think some people are using OEM throttle trigger setups for 660s...my AM 660 doesn't have the fast idle, but I never use it. On both of my Stihls, I choke until it pops, then immediately drop down to the normal throttle position and start. (I don't like to start a saw and have it immediately want to run fast.) YMMV...

 

[MG porting]

I recently fixed a customers 066 Round Top that had a leaking fuel tank with an Asian 660 fuel tank. However, I had to swap the control lever, trigger, trigger lock and spring to make it function like OEM.

So I know I'm going to be doing some tinkering with my Asian 660s to fix two common problems:

1) The saw will often not come off choke unless you depress the trigger, and they are difficult to get to stop in the Fast Idle position.

2) Even when you do get them to stop in the fast idle position, there is no fast idle.

I imagine I'll be pulling one of my 066s apart to compare the parts to the Asian 660s, but if anyone else has already done this and identified the problems, or knows how to resolve these problems, please share.

Thanks!!!

If it has no fast idle then replace both the trigger and the on off rod because I've tried it both ways and still had problems with the fast idle funny thing is my first ms660 I didn't have any problems with fast idle.

 

[MustangMike]

I actually have one apart now, and was playing with it before dinner trying to figure out what to do to make it work right. Tough to get these things to function w/o the top of the handle on.

May just rip my 066 apart to see what looks different. The AM one definitely does not like to "catch" on the high idle position (plus it does not work even when you do stop it there).

I'm sure I could buy OEM parts, but what fun would that be???

 

[MG porting]

I actually have one apart now, and was playing with it before dinner trying to figure out what to do to make it work right. Tough to get these things to function w/o the top of the handle on.

May just rip my 066 apart to see what looks different. The AM one definitely does not like to "catch" on the high idle position (plus it does not work even when you do stop it there).

I'm sure I could buy OEM parts, but what fun would that be???

I found that the trigger is a touch smaller at the tip where it rides on the shaft and if you notice there's two steps on the shat to everything needs to be just right to function properly heck iv worked on oem saws that had the Sam problem you can add jb weld to the trigger sometimes that works but you have to get it just right that mean taking a little bit off at a time. Trust me been there done that. Lol

 

[Wood Doctor]

I hate to say the same thing as MustangMike, but I must as he said here:

"1) The saw will often not come off choke unless you depress the trigger, and they are difficult to get to stop in the Fast Idle position.

2) Even when you do get them to stop in the fast idle position, there is no fast idle."

The failure to remain in fast idle position is a significant design flaw engineering mistake that Stihl never admitted to making and never offered a recall to correct. Three of their saws suffered from it: (1) 066, (2) MS650, (3) MS660. It usually starts appearing after about one-to-two years of normal operation but sometimes it shows up earlier. It's not the Asian controls that caused this. The Asians duplicated Stihl's controls perfectly.

 

[RedGas]

It's not the Asian controls that caused this. The Asians duplicated Stihl's controls perfectly.

Huh. I could have sworn that I saw a pic of an OEM and an Asian control lever assembly side-by-side, and the Asian one was missing an entire section that was present on the Stihl...

ETA: Never mind, I found the photo, and I guess it shows a broken one compared to an unbroken one:

It looks like Mastermind and Wood Doctor (who apparently came up with the shim that I mentioned earlier here) also posted in that thread, but for others, here's the full discussion:

https://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/066-does-not-have-a-fast-idle-on-cold-start.192288/

 

[Wood Doctor]

Huh. I could have sworn that I saw a pic of an OEM and an Asian control lever assembly side-by-side, and the Asian one was missing an entire section that was present on the Stihl...

ETA: Never mind, I found the photo, and I guess it shows a broken one compared to an unbroken one:

It looks like Mastermind and Wood Doctor (who apparently came up with the shim that I mentioned earlier here) also posted in that thread, but for others, here's the full discussion:

https://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/066-does-not-have-a-fast-idle-on-cold-start.192288/

Note on the "GOOD" control that right below the first "O" there is an arm cam that rubs against the throttle/trigger. It wears down and when it does, it no longer holds the fast idle. The tolerance is way too small, so sometimes it fails with no wear at all and the fast idle setting is thus gone.

Without the fast idle setting intact, the saw will not start when cold. The carb needs that fast idle setting. It's OK when the engine is warm, but not when it's cold. Stihl let this problem float for years and years and did nothing to resolve it.

 

[huskihl]

Note on the "GOOD" control that right below the first "O" there is an arm cam that rubs against the throttle/trigger. It wears down and when it does, it no longer holds the fast idle. The tolerance is way too small, so sometimes it fails with no wear at all and the fast idle setting is thus gone.

Without the fast idle setting intact, the saw will not start when cold. The carb needs that fast idle setting. It's OK when the engine is warm, but not when it's cold. Stihl let this problem float for years and years and did nothing to resolve it.

Is there noticeable wear on the trigger in the corresponding area when this happens?

 

[MG porting]

Note on the "GOOD" control that right below the first "O" there is an arm cam that rubs against the throttle/trigger. It wears down and when it does, it no longer holds the fast idle. The tolerance is way too small, so sometimes it fails with no wear at all and the fast idle setting is thus gone.

Without the fast idle setting intact, the saw will not start when cold. The carb needs that fast idle setting. It's OK when the engine is warm, but not when it's cold. Stihl let this problem float for years and years and did nothing to resolve it.

They will start cold without fast idle that why stihl did nothing to fix the problem it's all about how many times you feel like polling on the cord to get it going. Lol

 

[Wood Doctor]

They will start cold without fast idle that why Stihl did nothing to fix the problem it's all about how many times you feel like pulling on the cord to get it going. Lol

Some will and some won't. That's the problem. Some owners set the idle up way high to get around it. Then the chain ran around all the time, so the cure was worse than the disease.

 

[MG porting]

Is there noticeable wear on the trigger in the corresponding area when this happens?

Very little from the ones I've dealt with it don't really take much to make them work caret or not.

 

[MustangMike]

I have had saws pop, but not want to start w/o fast idle. Other times it does not seem to be a problem.

Bottom line, there is supposed to be a fast idle setting, and it should work.

 

[MG porting]

I have had saws pop, but not want to start w/o fast idle. Other times it does not seem to be a problem.

Bottom line, there is supposed to be a fast idle setting, and it should work.

Agreed no one wants to be struggling with the saw when all you want to do is get job done.

 

[RedGas]

I don't think I've used the fast idle more than once or twice on my Stihl 361, and never on my AM 660 (since it doesn't have a fast idle).
(Same story on the decomp: The handful of times I've used it on my 361, it's given me trouble, so I never use it anymore. And my AM660 doesn't have a decomp.)
They still start just fine hot or cold (after choking) at a normal idle speed, knock wood.